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My musings for today…

I caught up on this thread today starting with El Ciego’s last post and the responses, and it really got me to thinking. We all do a lot of gringa bashing, and this may fall into that category, but I got to thinking maybe we need to cut the gringas a break. I truly believe gringas are just as confused as we are about what is normal affection and how to bridge the gap from affection to sexuality.

In raising my K*ds the one lesson that I have been taught over and over, is that Ch*ldren learn from example. From an early age they model the adult behavior they observe. I have often seen my Ch*ldren imitate me, for better or worse. It can be quite humbling.

I also asked myself, why a woman would tease a guy in the way El Ciego described. The immediate reaction is that she must have known what she was doing, and what the effect on the guy would be, and therefore must intend to be cruel to behave in this way. However, I think we need to look at were gringas are learning their behavior. What models do they have of “normal” sensual and sexual interaction? Probably not from parents or relatives. In our highly moral sterilized society it is no longer appropriate for Ch*ldren to see their parents being affectionate, or at least anything more than holding hands, a hug, or a kiss (not a passionate one). They also get big doses of the, screwed up, morally censored, crap on TV. We display highly provocative images, but always in a look, but don’t touch context. So this is what young women today learn. To be highly provocative, to desire affection, but with the strong moral message that anything more, anything SEXUAL, is dirty and wrong.

The latinas on the other hand grow up in a culture that allows what I consider to be normal displays of human affection, and “GASP…” sexuality. They learn, from their parents, relatives, and other adult behavior models, that it is a natural progression from a look and a smile, to holding hands, hugging, kissing, touching, and having sex, and that it is a perfectly natural and beautiful part of life. Is it no wonder that we find them easier to understand and to be with?

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Tonka. (Still Alive and kicking.)

Tonka,

Very nice post & I agree with your read think you nailed it but all this is great to understand & where it came from & how it is but solves nothing for us in present or future so this is why I leave. I can not fight a tidal wave like the one that exists in the USA & keep my life in the proper balance I seem to need. I am lucky because I get enough from the USA also but not with a gringa. They are just too much trouble for me. I am not hateful about the way it is here as it is what it is & I accept this but they should not hate us for leaving to find greener pastures for ourselves either but I at least keep it as secret as I can & don't rub it in their face.

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"Run silent, run deep"
Spunk glazed Chicas are the building blocks of the universe!

i agree with the general trend here, having lived for 6 months in Costa Rica and now being back in canada working for 2 months. gringa's are in general nuts. I am posting on a new thread an excerpt from my blog on a dating site. it acts to automatically screen gringas, the funny thing is I am getting them contracting me. I think they all think they can "save me" from myself. The best part is saying no to the bullshit, knowing I am going to be back in Central America soon.

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The Wizard

"Women and cats will do as they please, and men and dogs should relax and get used to the idea." - Robert A. Heinlein


Doesnt look like Costa Rica for a while. Got offer 2 years in Singapore. Now what is a good hotel in Thailand. (New Weekend home).

Last week before heading to SJO I had a 1 hour telephone conversation with my 1st ex-wife. We've been divorced for 20 years (married for 9) and have alway maintained a good relationship. She's 51, intelligent and has always been pretty level-headed.
She's been married to a cop for about 17 years. They have 2 K*ds.
We live 1000 miles apart.

We were talking about things like why it's so hard to find dates when you're over 40 and why I travel to Latin America, etc.

She then said she had a petite, beautiful friend (42 yrs old) that just can't find a good man.

I said I would be up there in April and would love to meet her for "dinner and a few laughs". I also said just don't tell her you were married to me so she doesn't have any preconceived negative ideas.

When I returned from Costa Rica this was an email that was waiting for me:
Just to let you know, I've decided not to involve you and Kim. The more I thought about it and knowing her personality, I decided it was best for our friendship.

If you had not been my ex-husband and just an old friend I might have considered it. I don't think she would meet a person for a drink or otherwise without meeting them first. I feel even if she did agree to meet you, once she learned the truth of who you were, would have injured our friendship.

I will show her your picture......before I tell her who you are. She's very sweet but also reserved. Besides, I'm sure you do pretty well on your own!!

This was my response to her:
So you're afraid of damaging your friendship with Kim by introducing her to me? Thanks for the lack of confidence in me. It's too bad you can't give me some credit as an adult and a gentleman after 20 years.

You were going to introduce her to a cop with no class (his first words were, "Does she have tits?") because he was "good looking" but you're afraid introducing her to me would ruin your friendship?

It doesn't say much for your confidence in her, either. If she's in her 40s she can probably decide for herself if it was a worthwhile evening or not. Not every introduction has to be the prelude to a life-time committment.

You said she wouldn't meet someone for "a drink or otherwise without meeting them first." I'm a little confused. Just how do people meet someone if not to "meet them for a drink or otherwise".
It is a public place, you know. What are you guys, in high school?

As I said it was just dinner and some laughs, I wasn't going to proprose marriage or try and jump her in the backseat of her car. It was only 1 evening. Of course if you feel there is that much "drama" involved in a dinner introduction I don't really need it anyway.

And just for the record, I don't do "alright" on my own. In fact I don't date at all and haven't in this country since 1998. But if that's your decision I guess you have to do what you feel most comfortible with.
Thanks just the same.

I related this story to my 3rd ex-wife (Colombiana) today and she couldn't believe it either (she's met my 1st ex).

I guess I'll just never understand gringas.

I didn't think you were supposed to get invitations to join the A.A.R.P. until you turned fifty...but here I am, 48 and 1/2 years old...and the invitation came yesterday.

Now I feel old.

Wit, it's obvious that your first ex was screwing with your head. She offered to introduce you to a friend, then changed her mind... did you wonder why?

It's all about the control. Whether it's your ex playing head games, my prick-teasing "friend," or somebody else's horror story, they all seem to boil down to power games.

No, I don't buy Tonka's assessment of women growing up in N. America without good love examples. Our women have been perverted (and not in the "good" sense of the word) by modern culture, feminism, television advertising and the "freedom to choose." Since the invention of the vibrator, gentlemen, we are largely made redundant.

Scary... this will happen to latin America in a matter of years. Thanks to all the U.S. corporations who have crammed our so-called "culture" down the gullets and up the vaginas of the world's women. We're doomed.

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Pura Vulva! Wandering through the dark, I am El Ciego.

El C,
No, she's wasn't "screwing with my head". She's not the type.
Actually, I was the one that was pushing her for the introduction.

I think I wanted to make a couple points:
1. To show them both what a great date I am.
2. I'm not a no class asshole (like the other guy).

Besides, I can only hang out with my mom playing the slot machines for so long. I'll keep you posted on my 1st ex's response.

In regards to your situation I forgot to add:
I wonder what would happen if it was a blind woman being groped by a guy?

Wit

Let's not turn this into "abuse of the handicapped" issue. Blind or not, a woman who gets an unwelcome groping is always going to be the "victim," blind or not. Actually, it's not her groping me that bugged me; it's her constantly telling me how much she likes to give head, the frequency with which she seems to "accidentally" brush a breast or bun into me, the suggestion that I could have her but don't measure up to her boyfriend with 9 inches of man-meat, etc. etc. etc. She's a prick teaser, but as I noted, the blush is quickly coming off the rose, and the hot little slut act won't work for her for very much longer. Also, she has a voice that could peel paint.

Here's my prediction, and you guys should comment... I believe she will continue to deteriorate until no man in his right mind would want her. Then the teasing will stop and the attempts to truly get me into her life will begin. Of course, by then it will be too late.

And Wit, I enjoy playing slots with my Mom. She gives me nickels...

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Pura Vulva! Wandering through the dark, I am El Ciego.

Arent you guys forgetting something? Many of us believe women and men are never just "friends". Theres ALWAYS the sex thing, mystery, ying-yang...all that jazz. If I was still talking to my ex wives or called them "friends"...I would be lying. I would always be comparing myself to their current husbands or significant others. When my relationships are over...they are OVER. I dont think you can go backwards in relationship level or interest. Just my opinion...and I'm not here to burst my friends bubbles .

This modern notion in US culture that platonic ville and "just friends" is a good thing...well...like much of modern culture, I think they are fantasizing this notion. Sure, I can be "friends" with a 300 lb lady who's "nice"...but I still believe deepdown if anyone is honest with themselves...if the lady is attractive...you want to do her. You may NOT because of scruples you have learned (in a good way) that you dont trample on your buddies GFs or wives and respect their relationships...but from the animal side of things...you are still curious whether expressed or not.

Just the way it looks from here. Hey friends...dont let these ladies yank your chains... or your egos...its tough enough out there.

Tman, sure you're right.

In fact, the inability to go backward from a sexual relationship to being "just friends" has become another excuse in a woman's arsenal. "I'd love to have sex with you but I don't want to ruin our friendship." Ever heard that one?

By the way, difficulties finding sex in later life are not limited to single/divorced/widowed guys. I went to a Chinese New year party. Every one of my male friends in attendance except one had the same complaint. All are married, none ever get laid. The one exception is a 48 year-old guy who recently married a 24 year-old Brazilian hotty seven months ago...and she's currently on a two-month visit to Sao Paolo... trouble in Paradise?

I listened to eight different men, all roughly 48-49 years old, all married, complain that they never get laid. That was not a surprise, as saddening as it is. What really bothered me was the almost universal contention that at a certain point in one's marriage, sex is no longer of any significant importance. These guys were rationalizing their lack of sex, reframing it with acceptance and a shrug of the shoulders, as if sexless marriages were both inevitable and natural. What has happened to our culture? There's a reason it's called "making love;" sex is the way men and women are supposed to build love and loving, strong relationships. The fact that all my male friends, successful, educated, bright and healthy would so willingly give up sex really bugs me. Furthermore, they look at me as some kind of juvenile, perverted deviant.

They're great judges of character.

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Pura Vulva! Wandering through the dark, I am El Ciego.

Wit,

Thanks for sharing & I would expect this type of confusion on the part of a gringa. I am not surprised at all. Surprised she made as much sense if any that she did. I will tell you about some of my gringa relationships. At least 6 begged me to get married & I was polite but said I wasn't the marring type but many hung on for years telling me how much they loved me etc. & after bearing it all I have never had one ever call to see if I was even alive even though we ended on pretty mutual terms as I never lied to them in anyway & my phone # is the same.

Many told me once you love someone you never stop loving that person forever so if this was true is a simple phone call too much? I do not miss them but think this is funny after being so close for so many years & sharing so much. These relationships ended mainly from differences in goals that we wanted to pursue. I guess if I would have just been good friends they would still say hi ZIP from time to time. For me I want nothing just seems like there should be more than this death that exists.

This was my theory early in life that once separated it is this way so why get hurt financially & it has played out exactly like I thought it would. I just get a kick out of how we really work & you young guys shown read all this because it will work out like this for you I predict. I know we already know this but? I helped these gringas make a much better life for themselves. Most all had very good paying jobs & college degrees. Their finances were a mess (surprise right )so I helped them by rearranging & managing their own money so they bought their own house got the car paid for & started having a positive net worth. They were so happy with how their life had improved by their own money amazing!!

So even though they prospered & seemed to enjoy everything & we never fought at all (I can not tolerate fighting as I am not the adrenaline junkie type) but my unwillingness to sign papers to solve the rest of life's mysteries for them wasn't to be so we ended on as good as terms as you could because their we no lies misdirection’s & everyone prospered.

I am not upset by these things as I said I figured as much, a little disappointed that we couldn't call once every 5 or 10 years just for a laugh & compare notes on life would have been nice & I did call when I knew of a phone # but they changed #s I didn't? They also enjoyed the call when I was able to find a # so if you think you are gaining a life long friend by bearing your heart & soul to them think twice but the way it worked out I am glad I only helped with management & not my money with these old flames. I could have used these gringas pretty easy & taken advantage of their money but that is not my style & I have my own but I doubt if they ever really realized all that. Do you think for second money would have made a difference I don't think so. At least I have that money that would have been forever lost to wander into my future with & little Zippmiester is smiling at me right now as I type all this & he agrees I did the right thing!!

_________________
"Run silent, run deep"
Spunk glazed Chicas are the building blocks of the universe!

Although, sometimes, ain't no lovin' like the lovin' you get from a big woman.

YO Dear Abby:

Damn, aren't we a bunch of misfits!!! Hell, I can't even get a wayward sheep to look at this pitiful hombre unless it's starving and also grazing for dinero. Sort of reminds old Circus of Castro's Cuban boatlift where he sent most of Cuba's thieves, murderers and strangos to Miami. Hmmm, this could be the reversal......The U.S. is sending all it's sex starved gringos to Central and South America on the good ship "CRT Bounty" (Costa Rica Registry).

El Ciego, at least you are OUR perverted diviate. Hell, I'll bet those male friends of yours would welcome that title if they ever had balls to go south of the border and let their lust find fulfillment. You need to hand out some CRT brochures.....then again maybe not. They might muddy the waters.

Geezz Wit, that ex of yours is piece of work. Damn if I wouldn't stay a thousand miles from her periord. Personally, I think going out with her friend would be a big mistake anyway....really nothing to gain.

As far as seeing or re-kindling a relationship with an EX.....Guys, they are damaged goods. The only thing my ex wants is to squat and pee on my grave....and that's after she has hired someone to put me there.

PERSONALS UPDATE: As I posted earlier on this thread I have ventured into the dating sites for years. Get this! a 29 y.o. shapely lovely from Ghana now wants to come live with Doctor "Circus" (real profile name undisclosed) so she can continue her medical school quest. She says her father just died in Ghana and she needs help to return to the U.S. plus someone to live with. Sound familiar? Oh what a perverted diviat old Circus is. Hell, when she gets here and sees my dilapidated digs, Shitass and this worn out body...she might put me in a grave. Anybody out there need a 29 y.o. sweetie for a rommate? Nawwww

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Damn if I'm going to repeat this shit again. I need a drink.
I've been drinking vodka every day for 45 years and I have certainly never found it to be habit forming.

Here's the response I got from my ex on why she didn't think she should introduce me to her friend:

Okay.....comb your feathers down! I think you might be reading more into this than it is.

I wasn't worried about the introduction for fear that you would not be a gentleman. I do know that. I was uncomfortable with the way we were doing it. I was uncomfortable with being deceiving and not being honest about who you are.

Besides, I talked with her yesterday and she is seeing a guy from church. I asked her would she consider a blind date and she said "no way"!!

You brought up that I was going to introduce her to a cop because he was good looking. That's not accurate. The reason I was going to introduce them is because they are both fitness freaks. And they WOULD have met at my house with a group of other friends first.

Here is my response to her:
OK, thanks for the explanation.

Not a problem.
I didn't really believe your concern was about me (or at least I hoped it wasn't) and I understood your apprehension.

If a woman over 40 would stop being your friend because you introduced her to someone you were married to over 20 years ago she must be either too shallow or have way too many hangups for me to deal with. It's not like I am some drunk or child-molester or something.

It just sounded so........it just struck me in a negative way.

On the travel website that I am a member there are always on-going discussions as to why most of us have given up on American women. Unfortunately much of it is valid.

Plus I had just returned from Latin America where the women treat the men like men. Women in the 20s have a more 'adult' viewpoint on the male/female thing than what I got from your email.

Then I read about how you felt it would impact your friendship if you introduced her to me and she wouldn't meet me without an introduction and all the rest.

It just sort of confirmed some of the negative stereotypes regarding what we as American men have to deal with in regards to American women. Plus after our discussion last week concerning how hard it is to meet people when you get over 40 then you tell me you don't want to introduce us because blah, blah, blah.

After spending the better part of the last 8 years sharing my time with women from the Latin culture it's hard to go back to the games of dealing with American women. I just don't have the time or patience to deal with the pettiness and high-schoolish stuff.

Hopefully you can get some idea of how your email sounded to me.

Of course if we're that much different then that is a different story. If she's a regular church-goer that alone would be enough reason to not bother introducing us.

But life goes on.
You see, sometimes it's just more trouble than it's worth to get involved in some situations. Anyway, it was probably just as well.


The more I think about this the more it bugs me.
In a momemt of clarity I did uncover one big difference between the American and Latin cultures when it comes to romance.
American's tend to over analyze the whole thing. Latins just seem to "go for it".

I enjoy my trips but more and more I return home feeling they were unfulfilling.
I see myself turning into a lonely and bitter old man and it's starting to get to me.

And life goes on as the stomach turns.

Wit,

What ever you do you have to defeat this it will ruin your life & is good for nothing which only will serve to hurt yourself. Snap out of it there are thousands of happy chicas willing to help. Sounds like you need to find a meaningful one. Also compare your life to the average chica & they stay pretty optimistic.


I don't get this part with gringas either. You see a gal thats divorced 2 times with 2 K*ds & she acts as if she is a virgin??? They really think their little muff is gold plated or something? They sure do restrict their lives to a very narrow path I believe but hey it is their life & right but I will waste no time in trying to unlock this mystery as it is not worth it.

I couldn't agree more but I would have said most of the time not sometimes but that's just me.
Wit if each trip seems to be less fullfilling in CR you must not be utilizing you time very well too me. Get out of the gulch it does poison us after a while.

_________________
"Run silent, run deep"
Spunk glazed Chicas are the building blocks of the universe!