www.CostaRicaTicas.com

I agree 1000%.

Firstly, thanks to the Zip Man for the support.

I was hoping to stay out of this for a while, but I have to weigh in on this one and try and make peace or at least better explain my viewpoint:

I am really not interested if guys believe me or not or think I am a jerk (I am, live with it, I do), but I do know a little something about something having spent about 25 years traveling the globe courtesy of Uncle Sugar, as well as the corporate world.

I have said it before and I will say it again: If you are a half way decent looking Gringo, you get 5 bonus points everywhere you go that is worth going to. This means go to Ireland, England, Australia, Asia and New Zealand and of couse Latin America and if you talk long enough you will get laid for free. Add to that a knowledge of Spanish and you get another 5 points in L.A. However, it doesn't always work; get drunk or act the ass and it will count against you.

If you are not taking advantage of the 5 bonus points, you are missing the boat.

Even last year as an old man of 45, it look me an hour in a bar in Dublin to pick up an Irish lass, and in visiting her last thanksgiving, a buddy and I got hit on by some English girls during a hen party. Why? Because we were American. BTW, I told the Irish girl about the 5 bonus points theory and she admitted I was right during the hen party when the English lasses started hitting on us. The Irish guys say the same thing when they visit the U. S. where the girls all love the accent.

Same thing happened to me in Singapore with a Kiwi and in Korea with a German chick during the same business trip last year.

Ever notice that foriegn women are easier to talk to? I believe this is because normally your mutual experiences are so different, the difference is interesting.

What angered me was Prolijo's instance that all these experiences were dated and therefore it was all B.S. It is not true. To regular women, guys from different culture represent change and sometimes change is good. walk into any disco in CRand what the girls immediately know about you is that you are well off enough to be there and security is high on a women's list of priorities.

Now, I have nothing against working girls, it is just that after 25 years of Thailand, Korea, Brazil, CR, EL Sal, Colombia Honduras, Panama etc, etc, I find there is very little novelty or challenge in chasing working girls, especially when I know that there are regular girls out there that are do-able and are relatively free of drama.

Does this mean I would not have sex with a working girl? Absolutely not, it is just that I am not that much into it. When I travel I ususally don't make mongering the point of a trip, but a small aspect of it. I usually go diving instead. In fact, last time I went to CR, I had to remind myself on the last night in CR to pick up a working girl. She was from Colombia and seemed like a nice person, we chatted about Medellin (the only two women I every met that had been shot I met on the same night in Medellin). We had a nice time, nothing that exciting and she took her money and left. It was definitely not a GFE, not even a GFFE experience, it was strictly business and that is fine with me.

My next trip to CR will be 2 nights in SJ and the rest diving in Guancaste.
After that, I plan on a trip to Nicaragua. During both trips I am interested in meeting regular people and having a good time, if mongering works its way into the schedule, which it no doubt will, so be it.

So, I guess Prolijio is right, I am not looking for that GFE type of experience, but I begrudge no one the right to do so. I just get disappointed when I see some of these guys going nuts over working girls and getting drawn into their tumultuous lives when they could do so much better by spending a little extra time in meeting regular women.

I have dated some flakes before, but I think that their lives are sane in comparison of the girls in the life. That is why I don't advocate any of he gifts, RFM or treating the girls like a would be girlfriend. The bottomline is that 99 times out of 100 the girl is playing you.

BTW, Christopher Howard talks about this very subject in his book about retiring in CR. He details the acount of two Gringo who got wrapped up with working girls and lost everything. Anyway, I hope that clarifies my position somewhat. Well that is my position and I am sticking to it.

Posted: Fri Aug 19, 2005 9:34 pm Post subject: Gifts

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I have conducted a search and found nothing on the subject of gifts that guys take to give out.

I have read a few post on suckers (great idea! ), pearl necklace (OF COURSE ) and a few comments about tipping .

But money and obvious puns aside what kind of tokens does this board recomend I take for a trip? Perfume, if so what kind? Nail polish? Disposable cameras?

Any experienced board members ideas on this topic would be greatly welcome.
_________________
Bastion

How did we go from this to where we are at now?

d1

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Paradise= Sitting outside the Bodega in Panama City about 1 am. Drinking cool Balboas with cool friends and blazin' hot Colombianas. I want to be there..RIGHT NOW!

They love little cute bottles of different lotions or perfumes from what other guys have told me. Like the little trial or sample sizes packaged needly together. Cheep knock off watches also.

Dapanz1 I thought you would have liked all the wondering on this thread?

I highly recommend low value disposables.
Why?
Becuse if it has any value it will get stolen or sold.

Before I leave the States I hit the Dollar store for lolly-pops, other candy, shampoo, hair rinse, mouthwash, liquid soap, toothpaste, toothbrushes, etc.
Amazingly, Kotex type products are welcome. (many Ticas seem to use more primitive methods)
Crest makes a vanilla flavored toothpaste, not available in CR, that the girls love.
Sometime panties and perfume under $10.

My gifts are always appreciated.
If I really like the girl, and she has been a great GFE I will give her some of my low value clothes, instead of taking them home.
T-shirts with any kind of printing are always a success.
There is always a family member that can use them

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It is cheaper to pay now and get it over with.
It is also easier to get them to leave.

The topic turned interesting just on the wrong thread. Feel free to start a new thread.

dapanz1

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Paradise= Sitting outside the Bodega in Panama City about 1 am. Drinking cool Balboas with cool friends and blazin' hot Colombianas. I want to be there..RIGHT NOW!

Ok I will tie this more to the topic here. How does everyone feel overall about gift giving in general? I see this as breaking one of my rules as to not get to close to these chicas & keep it more a nice sweet loveable hour or two aerobics exercise with some penetration & I simply pay my instructor for my classes or session.

I believe even as nice as it may seem to give a present they really just want money & when you start giving presents you are sending a potential signal too her that you maybe a softy & like her too much for your own good & this may get them started spinning their webs of deceptions & you just encourage or invite this behavior with these actions. I rather give a gift to the attorney I met in Escazu in the above post even though I am not have relations with her.

Any thoughts out there?

Just a quick comment on the side topic and then I'll tie things back to the original subject.

Tim, there's no reason for you to be angry at me. I don't believe I ever said you were a jerk or a liar and the only thing I INSISTED on was that you fill is on greater specifics of your history so we could better evaluate where your perspective was coming from. Unfortunately, you failed to notice that I also said your posts were more insightful than 95% of the posts here and that I actually AGREED with most of what you had to say. Anyway, I'm certainly not angry with you and am prepared to write off your recent personal attack on me as just a brief emotional reaction. So are we CRT brothers?

Anyway, back on subject. I think our brief side trip does have some bearing on the subject of gifts and that is this. Over doing it steps over the line towards treating a commercial exchange as if it could be a real relationship. In that case, all a gift really amounts to is an attempt to purchase the chica's affections.

Unlike Zippy and Tim, I don't see anything wrong per se in offering chicas small tips or token gifts after a particularly good session IF THEY ARE KEPT SMALL AND REASONABLE. The problem is, as Zippy pointed out, that many guys don't know how to keep it in reasonable bounds. I'm much more concerned or disappointed with the guys who let their tips or gifts drift up to increasingly inappropriate amounts.

I laid out my own personal guidelines for tipping. I would apply the same standards as to how much to spend if I were to offer a gift instead of a tip, although I would think that everything being equal most (though certainly not all) chicas are just as happy if not more so with simple cash. OTOH, I think there are some chicas who enjoy the BFFE too. They're still basically hookers who have sex for money, but they like to maintain an illusion or fantasy even if for one brief instant that there is also something else to why they allow themselves to go with all those guys. Perhaps its because of the diminishment to their self esteem that results from what they do that they sometimes try to fool themselves into thinking they're more than just whores. The underlying principle is in some ways similar to why so many guys also like to fool themselves about the chicas. It makes the participants feel better about what could otherwise be seen as just some tawdry act.

The problem is at what point does a gift step over the line from being an affordable GFFE prop to being a wasteful act of self-deception. Different people have different standards as to what constitutes an appropriate tip or gift and many guys like Zip and Tim make valid arguments for never tipping or gifting at all. Certainly ticos don't tip let alone gift a working girl. And as I said before we don't normally tip or gift other types of working professionals in the US. However, I think nearly all of us (except perhaps Danielson) would agree that tipping or gifting at some point gets ridiculously extravagant.

So bottom line, IMHO if you must gift keep it to be stuff you can pick up at the dollar store or perhaps something more for the end of your stay for a multi-day chica. Don't tip and gift or if you do lower the amount you spend on both accordingly so that the overall amount given remains reasonable. If you gift by session there is no need to add an extra large gift at the end of your stay. Gifts help set a nice tone, but beyond a certain amount can create the impression that you're really stuck on the girl rather than just being nice and therefore are primed for being played for even more. Keep your statement of being nice and thoughtful tame and let your money doing the rest of the talking for you by buying more sessions. Anyway those are my thoughts, feel free to disagree

Is this like a game at a carnival? Do you show the gifts and then let her work for one of them or do you give a gift after the hopeful GFFE experience?

If I were to take gifts.... she'd be going to the carnival.

To give afterwards just doesn't make sense to me - she should be happy enough with cash.

The carnival would be pretty cool concept, put an Ipod, expensive perfume, some nice jewerly and then some cheap stuff among all the gifts and when you are done.... give the cheap stuff.

It certainly makes more sense to let her know ahead of time a gift might be in the cards if she did particularly well. But even if you just surprise her with it at the end, it might still make SOME sense IF you had definite plans to see her again. Presumably, no one here is foolish enough to give a gift to a chica that provided just a mediocre session and with whom they had no plans to repeat. The rationale, Dwayne is that if they got a gift once, the next time they meet you they' be more likely to put out that extra effort either in hopes of getting another one or in gratitude because they think you're such a sweet guy. Does it work? I don't know. There are guys who swear by it.

Another question is it any better than just a plain old cash tip? There are those that say she'd rather have cold hard cash, but there are others that feel some girls appreciate the personal humanizing touch of a gift. They've already gotten a load of cash from you. How much difference will giving them an extra 2-3K colones really make to them. 1K colones is just cab fare. Being handed a little more cash may be appreciated but does nothing to diminish their feelings of being a whore. Giving them a gift, even if it is just a small one, is just another way you can show them you see them as more than just a piece of meat for sale. It may sound silly, since effectively thats what she is, both you know it and she knows it, but as we all know there's nothing thats always logical to how these gal's think. We've all seen their jealousy and pride rear its ugly head at times. I really think that some chicas like to delude themselves about what they are doing as much as we like to delude ourselves. Giving a token gift is one way to play into their BFFE fantasies without stepping too far over the line.

OTOH, I do think that if it does make a difference there is a point where any benefits derived by shelling out money for expensive gifts do not justify the added cost. Different guys have different views on where that point might be. Personally I don't see much point in bargaining a girl down from CIEN/HORA and then effectively paying her close to that amount anyway after you factor in the gifts and tips. The way I see it, I'm paying the girls for a gfe quality session to begin with. If I wanted mediocre, I could get that in the US. I will tip or occassionally tip but only for girls that are truly exceptional even by CR standards, but again only for those I pay close to or below the typical CR rates (such as MP rates). If I'm paying top dollar at the BM (though never CIEN/HORA) she better damn well be exceptional even with out a tip or gift. Anyway that's my take.

BTW, Tim and Zip, I know gifting a working girl is not your approach but I'd like to know what you think about my BFFE theory. I'm sure one part of their brain always knows that they're just playing you but I also think that with SOME (particularly the less hardened) another part of their brain are thinking "Pretty Woman" - maybe this guy who seems a lot nicer than all the other creeps I see will rescue me from all this, I don't really love him but I like him so would that be so bad. They know the odds are bad just as we know the odds are bad (if not impossible) at turning a GFFE into a reality, but if they can play us along the way for money and gifts as we play them for GFE quality sex no one really loses. The problem comes when one or the other thinks it has become more real than it really is. We know how that plays out with us - complying with e-mailed RFM's. With them the symptom of an overactive fantasy is when they go into fits of jealous rage when they see us with a competitor (or is that just another girl stealing their money?). Anyway, I know its going a little off subject again but I'd like to hearing anyone elses thoughts on this.

The hookers that one could turn into a housewife, in my opinion, would be the ones that truly do this to make ends meet. A lot of them say that they are hooking, because they are supporting K*ds however they are at the HDR everyday! They don't have to be there everyday when with just 2 tricks they are making more than most madres who have the same amount of K*ds and aren't hooking. As soon as she starts to hook for material wealth, I'd say that there is no way she'll ever be wife material. People tend to take the path of least resistance in life so even if you are supporting a hooker from the USA (food and diapers and even rent money too), the minute she wants something material, her first instinct seems that it would be a visit to the HDR. Say 2 working girl are getting help from someone in the USA, the one that gets a normal job to support her wants rather than her needs is the one that honestly wants rescued (again, my opinion).

Of course, there is the situation where they are hooking to support mom, dad, hermana and tio tony is the excuse to be hooking but I think this is often just what it is - an excuse to be doing what she does best. There are more situations that may make a girl hook, but most of the time it seems a matter of taking the path of least resistance to get some cold hard cash. There is also the drug factor - they hook for more drugs. There is also the Ch*ld sexual abuse factor which gives them very low esteem - their self esteem will never allow them to escape a horrible life. For most who have low self esteem, you could offer them the world and because they don't feel worthy, they'll screw up a great situation. (I've been in this situation with a non working girl in the states).

Sorry, I'm all over the map, but basically I'm trying to cover the many reasons a hooker can't be a wife.

Oh, and Prolijo, the gifts for a good second session, I rarely do a second session with any girl (twice I have but one separate trips).

Why a hooker won't make a good wife is an old topic that few of us would dispute and is even more off the thread topic than what I was talking about. What I asked was whether some of these chicas choose to delude themselves in ways that, though different from the delusions some of us harbor, also have many similarities to them.

As for your "no repeat" or Slickwing's "no three-peat" policies, I think you guys are really missing out. Just because you see them more than 1-2 times, doesn't necessarily mean you're in any sort of danger of wanting to marry them. Certainly not for me and CERTAINLY not for any guy as grounded as you . Pursuit of variety would be one thing and if thats your reason than that would be a subject for another thread. But if not repeating has anything to do with what you've been saying warning others from getting too close to hookers, then you're really missing the boat.

In fact, as they get to know you and feel more comfortable with you they're more likely to really loosen up and give you their best session. Plus if they know you're a repeat regular client they're always going to try their best not to derail the money-train. Even if they only provide as good a session as the first time you were with them, it is usually worthwhile to repeat with achica that provided a better than average GFE quality session rather than take your chances all over again in the general pool of providers. When they do start to seem to take you for granted or seem to expect more money or fidelity than you're prepared to give, then it is the time to move on, but not according to any arbitrary one time or two time rule. Since you've never repeated you wouldn't have discovered this on your own. That's too bad for you.

I'll ask you one last question since whether to repeat with a chica is obviously a personal decision. Most guys do like to repeat with chicas that they like. You don't for some reason or other. So here's my question. Does your statement mean you're against offering gifts in general or are you only against it because being a non-repeater you have no reason to invest a small amount in trying to score an even better session next time around?

I'm not a repeater, because I don't want to pay the same dollar amount again when as you say she should be more comfortable and so it isn't a big a risk if she knows you. What is the sayings, the greater the risk the greater the reward, and so second time, thrid time, fourth time the risk is reduced. I'm not saying that on the fifth and more times I want her for 25 dollars because the risk are so low at that point. I just want a reasonable discount and I don't want to have to beg for it. But, I'd rather forgo dealing/begging with the same chica over and over again. Another reason for this is that with my limited Spanish, on multiple visits, I can't really talk much to her because we've covered the little stuff so there would be too much silence. I'd rather experience someone else and take my chances (the unknown is more exciting to me).

I have heard about reduced fees for repeating, but I think this is more often the case when you start high to begin with. I'm into 2 chicas a day when I get to CR and then as time passes, 1 a day, and I have even skipping days because there are other things to do and it just gets old. So, when I'm down to 1 a day and skipping days, I'd rather she be different. When I go to CR, my day is very packed with lots of other stuff so mongering is worked into my schedule, not the other way around. My trips to CR are more for the younger chicas than for females in general - getting laid in the states is easy if you join a personals website (I'm not straving for affection or waking up with someone else in the bed).

As for gifts, I'm pretty much against them, but if they work well for your style of mongering then go for it. I would implement the carnival concept rather than the surprise gift at the end. Or, maybe use the gift to get a second pop. Who knows, depends on the Chica....... depends on a lot of things and maybe you'll be the lucky one to get her when she is especially nice and in a great mood.

Dwayne,
Your logic escapes me once again. You say you don't do repeats because you think you should automatically get discounts the second time around and yet you don't get any special discounts either if you see a different girl for the first time. So while you might not get the price advantage you think you should seeing a girl again, there is still no price DISadvantage to seeing that provider (who you know does a good job) vs. having to negotiate with and see an unknown provider (who you have no idea how well she does). Also while you acknowledge that she will probably feel more comfortable and open with you after repeat visits, you seem to overlook the equally significant part that you also will feel more comfortable and open with her, knowing that she is not going to scam you or shortchange you in some way. It would be just as logical to assume that she should charge you more because of your greater comfort as it would be to assume as you have that she should charge you less because of her greater comfort. Which is more important to you, your comfort or hers? Very often you can get a discount, unless you did a flawless job bargaining her down to her bottom the first time around. But unless you're something really special, she's likely to have some minimal standard for what she is prepared to accept from anyone. If you can get a second time discount great, but if you can't you are still getting probably a better session than you got the time before for the same price and with far less risk and uncertainty than if you bag your chicas one at a time. I can appreciate different strategies IF the reasons for them make sense. Yours don't make any sense to me.

This is interesting too me. I am sure this varies from Chica to Chica but what I found once they realize you are not going to fall over the cliff with them the service that starts out so hot now just simmers along at a steady state not bad but not like the begining. This is why I found it better to move on.