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PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 4:07 pm 
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Irish Drifter wrote:
Thirdworld wrote:
Fact: Less than 1% of all overweight people have a medical reason why they can't lose weight.


Fact: Less than 1% of smokers have a medical reason why they cant quit!

Fact: Less than 1% of alcoholics have a medical reason why they cant quit!

Fact less than 1% of crack cocaine users have a medical reason why....

Fact less than 1% of degenerate gamblers have .....

Fact less than 1% of serial rapists....

Note: ALL of the above FACTS are pure BS. :lol: Some people have addictions, including various eating disorders, which are medically recognized. Any study claiming that over 99% of the entire obese population is suffering from nothing more than overeating is ridiculous on it face in my opinion.

How about some reference where you got that figure TW.


Here’s a novel idea: why don’t people simply eat less and move more… One can quantify this obesity epidemic all he wants – people simply need to start asking themselves better questions and stop consuming so much rotten flesh and fried foods at each meal


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 4:33 pm 
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Pacifica55 wrote:
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Fortunately I have never been diagnosed as morbidly obese or even obese but I did know someone who was morbidly obese. No amount of dieting helped.


Can't buy it. The human body is a simple machine. Put in less fuel than you burn and it runs on reserves stored as fat. Put in more than you burn and it stores the excess.


Perhaps you can't buy it but your approach is overly simplistic and does not take into account genetics, environment, illness, etc. Yes many people over indulge in both the amount and type of food thats leads to excessive weight. But to say all obese people are obese because of that behavior is simply not supported by competent medical professionals.

http://www.docshop.com/education/bariatrics/obesity/

However we have digressed from my original point which was publicly humiliating an overweight person is not only cruel it serves no legitimate purpose and to characterize that as you did "that is a compassionate humanitarian post." shows a lack of understanding and compassion.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 4:53 pm 
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Pacifica55 wrote:
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Fortunately I have never been diagnosed as morbidly obese or even obese but I did know someone who was morbidly obese. No amount of dieting helped.


Can't buy it. The human body is a simple machine. Put in less fuel than you burn and it runs on reserves stored as fat. Put in more than you burn and it stores the excess.

To my way of thinking, the US has gone waaaaay to far to make it comfortable for people to be gluttons and show it. There are no "big boned" people and the extra weight will kill you. How many really fat old people do, you see? Virtually none! There is a reason for that.

Yes, people are free to eat, drink and be merry but that does not mean we are doing them a favor by condoning the activity. Simple changes in diet and activity levels will take the weight off in time.


bravo, and what is really irritating is some days it seems like you spend all day slowly walking behind offensive tackles in everyday life, the aisles in the stores get smaller to max out merchandise and the people keep getting bigger and the aisles become impassable. is this fair to the rest of us?
worse yet is the fact that our tax dollars now go to fund the scooters these heffers now can obtain without spending a dime. and i find a lot of them have real attitude and entitlement issues because the laws are written to back them up.
why is this basically a US problem and doesn't exist on a similar scale anywhere else in the world? simple. we make it too easy for fat boys and girls to get fatter. thats a fact jack.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 4:59 pm 
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Irish Drifter wrote:
However we have digressed from my original point which was publicly humiliating an overweight person is not only cruel it serves no legitimate purpose and to characterize that as you did "that is a compassionate humanitarian post." shows a lack of understanding and compassion.


I am with ID on this and I'll share why. I was over 300lbs of walking man love on a 5'7" frame. I am 5'7" and 190lbs of man love now. I know both sides of this argument all too well. I grew up fat, and I was ridiculed and picked on all my life about it. It isn't fun and frankly it sucks. I knew I was fat, I didn't need some skinny, self righteous bastard pointing it out to me at every chance. There are lots of reasons why I was fat, one of the biggest was stress eating. When I'm stressed I crave food. It is a natural instinct. By having someone ridicule me for being fat it just turned me towards more food.

You don't cure obesity simply by eating less. It is a huge lifestyle change period and it will be one you have to maintain throughout your life. Genetics are a huge factor in obesity. Even though I am skinny now, without the aid of surgery or drugs, the medical reality is that the fat cells are still there and will gleefully absorb fat if I eat too much of it.

So picking on fat people serves no purpose other then to feel superior. Show some compassion and realize that they are struggling with it just as much as you may feel inconvenienced with it.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 5:01 pm 
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[/quote]However we have digressed from my original point which was publicly humiliating an overweight person is not only cruel it serves no legitimate purpose and to characterize that as you did "that is a compassionate humanitarian post." shows a lack of understanding and compassion.[/quote]

“Public Humiliation” Are you actually listening to yourself? The airlines have long since acknowledged the obesity epidemic and the infringement upon the comfort and safety of neighboring passengers – classified within the industry as a POS [person of size]. If you can’t fit your funk within your assigned cubical – then you’ll have to purchase another to accommodate the excess baggage disguised as your stomach.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 5:46 pm 
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Dramatist wrote:

“Public Humiliation” Are you actually listening to yourself? The airlines have long since acknowledged the obesity epidemic and the infringement upon the comfort and safety of neighboring passengers – classified within the industry as a POS [person of size]. If you can’t fit your funk within your assigned cubical – then you’ll have to purchase another to accommodate the excess baggage disguised as your stomach.


Guess you missed or did not understand what post I was referring to so I will quote it for you:

Quote:
lets humiliate these lard asses in a way that might actually work. hit em in the wallet so they have less for that super size.


That is a far cry from requiring a person who can not fit into one of the now downsized coach seat with a 32 inch pitch to purchase 2 seats. The airlines have pursued that policy long before obesity was recognized as a national problem.

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 Post subject: re: derriere
PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 6:43 pm 
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Have big fun with the following link: a 3-page ad in the Philly Inky weekend section 6/6/'08

www.flyderrie-air.com pack less. weigh less. pay less

P. S. read the closing lines on the last page closely.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 6:48 pm 
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I'm not up for humiliating anyone either, but am tired of hearing excuses for behavior. The gringa would be proud of the argument though... This is what you hear them going on and on about on talk shows in the states.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 6:56 pm 
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ok, the statement in question was made somewhat tongue in cheek. i have members of my family that are huge. and if i did not watch my intake i could easily rise into the 275 range. i stopped drinking for 12 years basically because my alcohol intake and sedentary lifestyle had taken me to the 235 range. i now weigh 195 and have to fight to keep my weight down. if i lapse from my reasonable exercise routine and began eating or drinking to much i will rapidly put on weight.
the thing that all the overweight people i know have in common is no self control and an unwillingness to deny themselves anything they want. some use it like drugs to satisfy their stress and or fears.
same as people who spent money they didn't have and now expect us who lived within our means to bail them out.
i see no reason we should pay extra for bags that weigh too much and not for people that weigh too much.
whether you make good choices or bad you live with the results of your decisions.
and no one seems to want to address why like so many other maladies obesity is almost uniquely an american problem. at least in the epidemic proportions we now can see.
:roll:


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 6:56 pm 
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Good find Jazzbo. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 8:11 pm 
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geez, what a crock.

What the fat haters are overlooking here (I'm not obese by the way. I have abt 20 lbs extra on my frame, which is hardly a call to arms) is that even the fit males will be discriminated against. A fat woman will possibly weigh less than a fit man, and will pay less for the ticket anyway. You can mock her lifestyle all you like and she'll STILL pay less than you do. I'm not quite sure how you fit that into your theory of lifestyle economics. Or do we now have to set up different weight tables for women?

Does a guy that's 5'6' amd weighs 150lbs live a better lifestyle than a 6'2" guy that's fit and weighs 210? I don't think so. But the second guy will pay more for being naturally bigger, no matter how fit he is. Athletes and bodybuilders will naturally weigh more with more muscle mass, but they will be penalized for it. The argument against fat people is a one dimensional argument, doesn't take into account the complexities of implementing such a policy, and doesn't demonstrate any type of understanding or empathy for the individual who may be larger either by virtue of genetics or by virtue of lifestyle. Airlines could very well alienate parts of their customer base at a time when they simply can't afford to do so. They'd be better off to simply raise fares or luggage costs across the board and avoid the PR nightmare that would be sure to ensue.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 8:39 pm 
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Shadowman,

Did you miss the disclaimer at the bottom?

The Derrie-Air campaign is a fictitious advertising campaign created by Philadelphia Media Holdings to test the results of advertising in our print and online products and to stimulate discussion on a timely environmental topic of interest to all citizens. All names, identities, characters, persons, whether living or dead, companies, situations, offers, products, services, and other information appearing in this campaign and the associated website are fictitious. Any resemblance to real or fictitious names, identities, characters, persons, whether living or dead, companies, situations, offers, products, services, or other information, is purely coincidental and unintentional. In other words, smile, we're pulling your leg.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 8:50 pm 
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ID, I wasn't referring to the Derrie ad, which I thought was pretty funny, and no, I didn't miss the disclaimer. :lol:


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 8:55 pm 
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Repeat after me:

If you are naturally thin, you have no business criticizing the weight of others. You simply cannot comprehend the issues involved, no matter how much you think you do. And no, fighting to keep that extra 20lbs off doesn't mean you're not naturally thin.

I'm not trying to excuse fat, cause god knows I have plenty of blame for my own. I'm simply pointing out that what's easy for you is not easy for others, and you can't judge them by your own standards.

It's very hard for people to sympathize or empathize with things they cannot comprehend. As an example, I have sleep apnea (i'm sure many people here do as well, it's fairly common). Most people with sleep apnea have trouble sleeping and don't get enough sleep. I'm the opposite, I sleep longer, sometimes 10, 12, 16 hours straight, because i'm in a chronic state of sleep deprevation.

Most people cannot understand how someone can sleep 16 hours straight. How they can sleep through loud alarm clocks, or turn them off in their sleep. I've lost dozens of jobs because I couldn't make it into work on time, related to my chronic over sleeping. Most of my bosses simply thought I was lazy and couldn't understand how someone couldn't just wake up in the morning. I must, they logically conclude, simply want to sleep in. I would compensate for my tardiness by working late, and doing extra work, but that never seemed to matter to these people, they saw the coming in late part as evidence of my laziness and eventually let me go. Eventually, I simply started my own consulting company, where I could control my hours.

People have different metabolisms, they have different body chemistries, they have different genetics, some of which predispose people to becoming obese far easier than others.

We've all known the person that eats like a horse and never gains a pound, and we also know the person that can diet religiously for months and barely lose any. Which is not to say that most people who claim that dieting and exercise don't work for them aren't full of shit.

It's harder for some people than others, even harder still for some others. Weight gain is a feedback loop, as you gain more weight it becomes harder and harder to lose it because it becomes harder and harder to exercise. What's worse, exercising heavily at high levels of obesiety can cause severe injury or other medical issues.

People gain weight for different reasons. My problem was not that I couldn't stop eating. My problem was that I didn't eat often (usually only 1 meal a day, and then it was usually after midnight), and when I did I was starving and ate way too much. My body shut down because it thought it was starving, and then when I did eat, it packed on all the extra calories. I didn't eat that much more than someone who would eat regular meals, but because of the way i ate, my body treated it differently.

Most of the people who have trouble with diets have trouble because they starve themselves, and when they don't see results they get depressed and figure, "why bother? It doesn't matter either way, at least if I eat i can enjoy myself" It's a psychological problem among others.

The human body is *NOT* a simple machine. It's not a simple formula of caleries vs. exercise. For example, in many cases, if you start to starve yourself, your body will canabalilze muscle before fat (for example, reducing heart muscle), because it thinks that reducing calorie burn will save fat for longer periods of starvation. Your body will only burn fat when a) it has no other choice, or b) it is getting regular nutrition, but not enough to cover the calorie burn.

Having said all that, losing weight is not rocket science either. But, it does require changing habits, lifestyles, attitudes, and trusts. That's a lot of change for most people, not simply deciding to eat less and exercise more. Count yourself lucky. VERY lucky if you believe that all it takes is a little effort.

On a side note, I *AM* big boned. In the army, I was skinny as a rail, and weight 220 (at 6'3"). Large boned (or large framed) people have more skeletal mass and more muscle mass to move it, not to mention more fluids in the body (which are pretty heavy too). Big boned does exist, though many people use it incorrectly. So i'm supposed to pay more than 100 pound asian woman? Bullshit.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 9:41 pm 
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Pacifica55 wrote:
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Fortunately I have never been diagnosed as morbidly obese or even obese but I did know someone who was morbidly obese. No amount of dieting helped.


Can't buy it. The human body is a simple machine. Put in less fuel than you burn and it runs on reserves stored as fat. Put in more than you burn and it stores the excess.

To my way of thinking, the US has gone waaaaay to far to make it comfortable for people to be gluttons and show it. There are no "big boned" people and the extra weight will kill you. How many really fat old people do, you see? Virtually none! There is a reason for that.

Yes, people are free to eat, drink and be merry but that does not mean we are doing them a favor by condoning the activity. Simple changes in diet and activity levels will take the weight off in time.


How old do you mean? I have alot of big boned folks in my family and we are all big people. And we live long as well :D

NYG

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