www.CostaRicaTicas.com

Welcome to the #1 Source for Information on Costa Rica
It is currently Wed Jun 18, 2025 2:59 pm

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]





Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 55 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: Columbia
PostPosted: Mon May 26, 2008 1:06 am 
PHD From Del Rey University!

Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2004 6:55 am
Posts: 2171
WayneH3412 wrote:
Rainman - Even when I lived in Honduras Columbia had a notorous rep for being a place of ladrones and violencia. I was a Peace Corps Volunteer there. One of the guys married a Columbian girl and his wedding suit was ripped off from his room the night of the wedding.

In Columbia I was in Cali:

- I heard from an amiga of taxi scams where they would just drive you around the neighborhood a few times to up the cost. One person jumped out after he saw the same sign after 15 minutes of driving.

- Anti gringo sentiment. Younng Colunbians would give you the finger from passing cars etc... something that never happened to me in Costa Rica.

- A man slapping around a woman hotel clerk late at night.

- Women in hair pulling fights in the market..

-I myself was younger then and slept on the beach in San Andres keeping my camera in my boot Next morning it was gone.

For a historical perspective on Columbia read Gabrial Marquez. Non stop violence going on for decades and this is even before the drug cartels.


I have seen all of this in SJO and more so to me your point is moot. Parking garage next to NY bar... cops shoot a guy dead. Yellow tape and TV crews everywhere. If this is all you have on Colombia... well, it isn't much and I haven't even been there. In just the last month 3, I believe, folks assassinated on the streets of SJO. You call Colombia dangerous? When were you there last?

Berk....

_________________
FRUITCAKE... and you thought it was something you eat! Not on CRT!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon May 26, 2008 2:14 am 
Masters Degree in Mongering!

Joined: Sun Jul 29, 2007 4:28 pm
Posts: 705
My tico friends tell me that by and large, the most violence is perpetrated by colombians in Costa Rica. A tico is more likely to pick pocket you, or try to scam you, they might break into a dark house, or they do smash and grabs.. Colombians are the people that hop in a cab, kill the taxi driver, take his cab and pick up a gringo and rob him at gun or knife point. Colombians walk up to people in cars, in crowded areas, and hold them hostage at gunpoint for their belongings. They just don't care.

The fact of the matter is, crime happens where people are poor. Violent crime is bred from a culture of violence, and because of the drug cartels in Colombia for the last 30 years, that's what their young men tend to grow up in.

That's not to say that Colombia doesn't have beautiful, fairly safe places. I'm not saying that all Colombians are violent criminals either. I hear great things about Medellin, but you're far more likely to be a victim of a violent crime by a Colombian than a cost rican. And the fact that Colombians, by and large, tend to hate americans is just par for the course.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Columbia
PostPosted: Mon May 26, 2008 7:46 am 
PHD From Del Rey University!
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jul 30, 2006 7:06 pm
Posts: 1545
Location: Stuck in Louisiana"dreaming bout Paisitas, Calenas & Costenas"
Berk2302 wrote:
WayneH3412 wrote:
Rainman - Even when I lived in Honduras Columbia had a notorous rep for being a place of ladrones and violencia. I was a Peace Corps Volunteer there. One of the guys married a Columbian girl and his wedding suit was ripped off from his room the night of the wedding.

In Columbia I was in Cali:

- I heard from an amiga of taxi scams where they would just drive you around the neighborhood a few times to up the cost. One person jumped out after he saw the same sign after 15 minutes of driving.

- Anti gringo sentiment. Younng Colunbians would give you the finger from passing cars etc... something that never happened to me in Costa Rica.

- A man slapping around a woman hotel clerk late at night.

- Women in hair pulling fights in the market..

-I myself was younger then and slept on the beach in San Andres keeping my camera in my boot Next morning it was gone.

For a historical perspective on Columbia read Gabrial Marquez. Non stop violence going on for decades and this is even before the drug cartels.


I have seen all of this in SJO and more so to me your point is moot. Parking garage next to NY bar... cops shoot a guy dead. Yellow tape and TV crews everywhere. If this is all you have on Colombia... well, it isn't much and I haven't even been there. In just the last month 3, I believe, folks assassinated on the streets of SJO. You call Colombia dangerous? When were you there last?

Berk....


Berk,

Wayne is communicating with me via PMs as I attempt to educate him on modern Colombia. FYI, he was last in Colombia in the 1970's and than in Cali......and he has heard it has only gotten worse since than.......GET THE PHUCK OUTTA HERE !

Rainman3


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon May 26, 2008 9:50 am 
PHD From Del Rey University!
User avatar

Joined: Tue Aug 09, 2005 5:21 pm
Posts: 2024
TheMadGerman wrote:
And the fact that Colombians, by and large, tend to hate americans is just par for the course.


This is completely recockulos!

The Colombian people are very warm, inviting, and curious about Americans.

TheMadGerman wrote:
My tico friends tell me that by and large, the most violence is perpetrated by colombians in Costa Rica. A tico is more likely to pick pocket you, or try to scam you, they might break into a dark house, or they do smash and grabs.. Colombians are the people that hop in a cab, kill the taxi driver, take his cab and pick up a gringo and rob him at gun or knife point. Colombians walk up to people in cars, in crowded areas, and hold them hostage at gunpoint for their belongings. They just don't care.


My tico friends tell me that the Dominicans and the Nicos are the worst.

Your comments comparing crimes commited by Ticos vs Colombians fails to mention that sometimes foreigners without opportunities in any country resort to committing crimes to survive.

I can completely understand why a Colombian in Costa Rica is more likely to rob you, but take a Tico to Nicuargua and see if the Tico won't rob you after running out of money and struggling to survive in a foreign country. This in regards to illegal immigrants, not someone who entered another country legally with opportunities to work.

TheMadGerman wrote:
The fact of the matter is, crime happens where people are poor. Violent crime is bred from a culture of violence, and because of the drug cartels in Colombia for the last 30 years, that's what their young men tend to grow up in.


Too often people equate crime with poverty, but I say you're wrong.

I've been to many very poor barrios in Costa Rica and even moreso in Colombia and can says that the people in those barrios are hard working citizens who denounce crime and violence.

Have you been to Colombia lately?


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon May 26, 2008 11:47 am 
PHD From Del Rey University!

Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2004 6:55 am
Posts: 2171
:lol: :lol: :lol: Rainman... your reply get the phuck outta here strikes me as pretty funny....... considering how straight you are! :lol: :lol: :lol: Ah well..... getting up every morning is dangerous... I could DIE before the day is over! :D

Berk....

_________________
FRUITCAKE... and you thought it was something you eat! Not on CRT!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon May 26, 2008 1:52 pm 
Masters Degree in Mongering!

Joined: Sun Jul 29, 2007 4:28 pm
Posts: 705
Traylor,

You're confusing crime with violence. There's lots of ways to rob someone without violence, and ticos are, by and large, not very violent people. Even in other countries, i'd wager they resort to violence to achieve their goals far less than those of other countries.

And even when a tico gets violent, they're far less likely to kill someone. Colombian criminals just don't care if they kill your or not. Killing you is easier when there are no witnesses.

And again, I didn't say that poor people are criminals. I said, wherever there is poverty, there will be crime. Some people will always go that route, while most will simply do the best with what they have.

Here's a good example. You'll be hard pressed to find a costa rican "gang". They're pretty common in Colombia (just as they are in the US).


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon May 26, 2008 2:19 pm 
PHD From Del Rey University!
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jul 30, 2006 7:06 pm
Posts: 1545
Location: Stuck in Louisiana"dreaming bout Paisitas, Calenas & Costenas"
Berk2302 wrote:
:lol: :lol: :lol: Rainman... your reply get the phuck outta here strikes me as pretty funny....... considering how straight you are! :lol: :lol: :lol: Ah well..... getting up every morning is dangerous... I could DIE before the day is over! :D

Berk....


Berk,

No disrespect or discourtesy to you by my comment. Sometimes when I hear shit that is "SO STUPID" it just brings the ole gruff ex infantry officer out in me. What I was talking about was for everyone to "get the phuck out of here" with your comments that the FARC and the cartels control all of COL and "OHHHHH COL is much to dangerous to visit..........."Ohhhhh the Colombians are much to violent to risk going there....... Wayne, you cannot base the current security situation in COL on GGM's "100 years of Solitude" and yes I have read it and a couple of more of his besides.........

Mad German...Tengo una pregunta......Have you ever been in COL ?????

Rainman3


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon May 26, 2008 2:26 pm 
PHD From Del Rey University!
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 16, 2004 10:24 pm
Posts: 11358
Location: Sabana Oeste , Costa Rica
It seems every time the relative safety of Colombia vs Costa Rica is brought up what is really being compared is Medellin and San Jose. I do not know which is more dangerous and am not going to speculate on that. However a recently released report shows that the country of Colombia is definitely more dangerous than Costa Rica.

While this report is focused on Venezuela it does provide some information on Colombia and Costa Rica.

Quote:
VENEZUELA:
Fifty-Two Violent Deaths a Day, and No Respite in Sight
By Humberto Márquez

CARACAS (IPS) - On the day a report was released ranking Venezuela as one of the most violent countries in the world, a local anti-drugs prosecutor was murdered, a mob lynched a suspected criminal in the capital, and gunmen fired 20 shots, killing another suspect.

In the 72 hours leading up to the publication of the Global Peace Index (GPI), 70 murders were reported in the metropolitan area of Caracas, which has five million residents.

One of the victims was Oskel Rubio, a mechanic who maintained the motorcycles used by President Hugo Chávez’s bodyguards. He was killed by thieves who stole his car in the densely populated western area of the capital.

His mother, Elizabeth Rubio, complained that police at the entrance of the hospital where her seriously wounded son was taken delayed his admission to the medical centre and stole some of his belongings.

In the 24 hours prior to the publication of the GPI report on Tuesday, five minors were shot to death, including a six-year-old girl who was shot in the chest as she played at home in western Caracas at breakfast time, and an 11-year-old boy riding in a bus who was killed by cross-fire between rival gangs in an eastern part of the city.

Colombia and Venezuela are the only countries in the Americas coloured red on the map of the GPI, a peace and violence ranking based on 24 variables in 140 countries, compiled by the Intelligence Unit of the British news magazine The Economist, in conjunction with the Institute for Economics and Peace.

At the most violent end of the spectrum, with more than 3,000 points, is Iraq, accompanied by Somalia, Sudan, Afghanistan and Israel, while the most peaceful countries, coloured blue on the map, are Iceland, Denmark, Norway, New Zealand and Japan, with less than 1,400 points.

Within Latin America, the least violent countries are Chile, Uruguay, Costa Rica and Panama.

In the report, Venezuela is in 123rd place with 2,505 points, close to Colombia, in 130th place with a score of 2,707. Between them in the ranking are Zimbabwe, Sri Lanka, Burma (Myanmar), Pakistan, Nigeria and the Democratic Republic of the Congo.

"The difference is that Colombia has experienced an acute armed conflict for 50 years that has given rise to criminal paramilitary groups, drug traffickers and hired killers, which is not the case in Venezuela," Luis Cedeño, of the non-governmental Caracas-based Institute for Research on Coexistence and Citizen Security (INCOSEC), told IPS.

Between August 2006 and September 2007, 395 teenagers and Ch*ldren in Venezuela met violent deaths, including 21 who were killed by the security forces, 20 who were caught in the crossfire and nine who were killed in accidental shootings, Oscar Misle, of the children’s rights organisation CECODAP, told IPS.

"Violence among teenagers is rising, reaching into schools and making them unsafe places. Among its causes are issues like drugs, family instability, lack of coordinated policies to deal with the problem and the proliferation of firearms," said Misle.

Amnesty International reported in April that in Venezuela, a country of 27 million people, there are some six million guns, of which only 1.5 million are legally registered. "There are too many, and the authorities don’t have precise estimates of how many there actually are," retired former chief of the judicial police Pablo Guzmán told IPS.

Interior and Justice Minister Ramón Rodríguez said that in the first quarter of 2008, the number of homicides in Venezuela decreased by 7.7 percent compared to the same period in 2007, when 621 murders were committed.

Two weeks ago a motorist had a fatal crash in front of the ministry as he fled from assailants who wanted to steal his car.

According to judicial police records, there were 13,156 murders in 2007, another 1,579 deaths for "resisting authority," and a further 4,264 fatalities "under investigation," giving a total of 18,999 violent deaths.

"That is equivalent to 52 murders a day, and a murder rate of 48 per 100,000 population if legally confirmed homicides are considered, but if all the violent deaths are taken into account, the rate is 69 per 100,000 population. More than 95 percent of these deaths are from gunshot wounds," Cedeño said.

Nationwide, 12,257 homicides were recorded in 2006 (a murder rate of 45 per 100,000 population), 8,022 in 2000 (33 per 100,000), 4,481 in 1995 (21 per 100,000) and 2,474 in 1990 (13 per 100,000).

By comparison, the United States has a murder rate of 5.7 per 100,000 population, Canada 1.85 per 100,000 and Germany less than one per 100,000.

Caracas, with 130 homicides per 100,000 population, or 166 if all violent deaths are taken into account, has overtaken Recife, in northeastern Brazil, which has a murder rate of 158 per 100,000, as Latin America’s most violent city, said Cedeño.

Violence is a big problem in all of Venezuela’s big cities, and personal insecurity is the most pressing concern mentioned in opinion polls.

Criminologist and former judge Mónica Fernández told IPS that "cold-blooded and excessively violent murders, not with one or two bullets but 20 or 30, not only indicate serious pathology or drug use, but also a defiant attitude and rampant impunity."

Police investigations are completed on less than half of reported homicides, and only a small fraction of these lead to conviction and sentencing.

Violence in Venezuela is a long-standing problem, which the government of President Hugo Chávez, in office since 1999, has failed to adequately address, despite reforms of the prison system and a restructuring of the police forces.

Social psychologist Roberto Briceño-León said that "tolerance of impunity and the violent political climate encourage permissiveness. Potential criminals do not feel that if they commit a crime, there will be consequences."

"Violence is a sort of amniotic fluid in which Venezuela is floating," Magally Huggins, a criminologist and professor of clinical psychiatry and psychology at the Central University in Caracas, told IPS.

_________________
:D Pura Vida :D
Only Irish coffee provides in a single glass all four
essential food groups:
alcohol, caffeine, sugar and fat.
Alex Levine
Image


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon May 26, 2008 2:35 pm 
PHD From Del Rey University!

Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2004 6:55 am
Posts: 2171
Rainman..... I never thought your comment was directed to me or actually anyone. Not a problem. I got a good laugh out of it. :D

Berk....

_________________
FRUITCAKE... and you thought it was something you eat! Not on CRT!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon May 26, 2008 2:36 pm 
PHD From Del Rey University!
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jul 30, 2006 7:06 pm
Posts: 1545
Location: Stuck in Louisiana"dreaming bout Paisitas, Calenas & Costenas"
For your consideration my fellow adventure travelers,

Subscribe RSS
Food for Thought - the Most dangerous Cities in the Americas?
By ricardo_emp | Location: Colombia | 09/07/07
A new article in today’s LP forum about the most dangerous cities in the Americas. Unfortunately the contributor did not source from where he lifted the facts and figures.

Reading today’s Lonely Planet Thorn tree forum on Colombia – I noted this scale. Pretty morbid I know but one that we are all likely to look at and probably think about. I for one find myself picturing the city mentioned and thinking about my time there. I can say that I have had some scrapes in Guatemala City, Rio and Quito, but for the most part my experiences are far better than just positive. So, I think it is always important to take the examples, like the one included below and taken from the forum into perspective.

Per 100,000 people murders per year are as follows1. Recife, Brazil – 158


2. Caracas, Venezuela - 133

3. Guatemala City, Guatemala - 103

4. San Salvador, El Salvador - 95

5. Sao Paulo, Brazil - 55

6. Rio de Janeiro, Brazil - 53

7. Washington DC, USA - 34

8. Lima, Peru - 22

9. Bogota, Colombia - 18

10. Quito, Ecuador - 16

11. Buenos Aires, Argentina - 12

12. Santiago, Chile - 6




Quite obviously the figures for Santiago are low, having been to every city on that list and having lived at length in a few of them, I can vouch for the incredible security in Chile.

There is no doubting that Recife due to its high unemployment and delinquency levels is up there…it is also unfortunate since the northeast of Brazil is a wonder to behold. Just a short bus ride to the north is Olinda, one of the most beautiful examples of Portuguese colonial architecture in that country.

Caracas has been touted by some as being the most unsafe city in the Americas now and its new position as No2 would probably lend credence to this. I have friends who state that it will be at No1 within a year or so.

Interesting to see Rio and Sao Paulo in their current positions. I wonder how many extra judicial killings take place that remain unreported. Certainly last year when I lived and worked in the Mangueira favela of Rio we heard a good many stories of this. Shocking stories.

My heart aches for the Central American capitals on this list. Guatemala City’s problems are stemming this year from the upcoming elections (political rivals are being murdered) and the gang wars prevalent there. Gangs like the Mara Salvatrucha and 18 are responsible for, I should think, most of the deaths in San Salvador as well.

No mention of Georgetown, Guyana on this list either. A city where I felt distinctly ill at ease.

Rainman3


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon May 26, 2008 3:53 pm 
Masters Degree in Mongering!

Joined: Sun Jul 29, 2007 4:28 pm
Posts: 705
Update: I just realized this data is almost 10 years old. There's a comment further down the page for 2005 that suggests the murder rate is almost half the rate from 2000, still that's a lot.

Look, I'm not saying that everywhere in colombia you're just begging to get shot if you show your face. I'm just saying that it *IS*, on average, more dangerous to your life there than in costa rica.

Check this site out:

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_mur_percap-crime-murders-per-capita

Colombia is #1, Costa Rica #19.

This translates to 6 murders for every 10,000 people and .6 per 10,000 respectively. That's an order of magnitude.

You're also almost 20x more likely to be killed by a gun in Colombia than in Costa Rica.

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_mur_wit_fir_percap-crime-murders-firearms-per-capita

Now, if we look at other crimes:

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_bur_percap-crime-burglaries-per-capita

Burglaries shows Colombia is pretty low at 3 per 10,000 (Costa Rica isn't listed, but i'd guess it's higher.. no evidence, just my guess.

But let's look at another interesting statistic, Roberies.

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_rob_percap-crime-robberies-per-capita

Costa Rica is #3! at 4.7 per 1000, and Colombia is #31 at 5.7 per 10,000.

This data might be a bit skewed because my guess is that costa rica counts burglaries as robberies, which is why they have no data listed for burglaries.

Another interesting statistic is frauds

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_fra_percap-crime-frauds-per-capita

Costa Rica is #35 at 3 per 10,000 while colombia is at #60 at 2 per 100,000.

All this goes to show is that Costa Ricans are more likely to use non-violent means to get what they want, while Colombia is the single most violent country in the americas, by a long shot.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon May 26, 2008 4:22 pm 
Masters Degree in Mongering!

Joined: Sun Jul 29, 2007 4:28 pm
Posts: 705
A better source is this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_homicide_rate

Scroll down to the 2000's, as of 2006 Colombia is at 37.3 per 100,000 and Costa Rica is at 6.23 per 100,000. You're about 6x as likely to be killed in Colombia than in Costa Rica.

Also, here's an interesting paper:

http://iicas.ucsd.edu/research/projects/dwds/papers/Soares_and_Naritomi--Crime_in_Latin_America.pdf

Some things that stick out:

"Still, there are marked differences in country specific experiences within Latin America itself. In the victimization dataset, a very narrow set of countries is available (Argentina, Bolivia, Brazil, Colombia, Costa Rica, and Paraguay), but still victimization rates ranges from 4.6% to 14.4% for burglary, 11.8% to 20.2% for thefts, and 11% to 21% for contact crimes. Costa Rica, for example, has both relatively low crime and low mortality due to violence, while Colombia has high marks in both statistics."

And once again, for those that like to jump to conclusions. I'm not saying your pet destination is a murder zone. I'm sure it's great. All indications are that Medellin, for example, has significantly reduced it's murder rate, but in the 90's it was one of the worst cities in the world.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon May 26, 2008 4:25 pm 
PHD From Del Rey University!
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jul 30, 2006 7:06 pm
Posts: 1545
Location: Stuck in Louisiana"dreaming bout Paisitas, Calenas & Costenas"
Mad German,

Sufficiente, sufficiente, no mas, no mas porfavor !

You are right ! Im just an adrenaline junky and nothing gets my rocks off like sexo with a hot Colombiana along with the high likelihood of possible violent sudden death at the hands of a Pablo Escobar wanna be.

For the love of Jesus everyone, please stay out of Colombia. Do not take the risk when you boys have the HDR/KL and Zona Blue there along with all the peaceful greengo loving Ticos.

Rainman3


Last edited by Rainman3 on Mon May 26, 2008 8:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon May 26, 2008 6:29 pm 
PHD From Del Rey University!
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 16, 2004 10:24 pm
Posts: 11358
Location: Sabana Oeste , Costa Rica
Rainman3 wrote:
Mad German,

Sufficiente, sufficiente, no mas, no mas porfavor !

You are right ! Im just an adrenaline junky and nothing gets my rocks off like sexo with a hot Colombiana along with the high likelihood of possible violent sudden death at the hands of a Pablo Escobar wanna be.

For the love of Jesus everyone, please stay out of Colombia. Do not take the risk when you goys have the HDR/KL and Zona Blue there along with all the peaceful greengo loving Ticos.

Rainman3


Nothing quite as satisfying as seeing the person who was bested in a debate withdraw graciously. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: Some folks would just post a sarcastic answer which lends nothing new to their position. :roll: :P :shock:

_________________
:D Pura Vida :D
Only Irish coffee provides in a single glass all four
essential food groups:
alcohol, caffeine, sugar and fat.
Alex Levine
Image


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon May 26, 2008 7:28 pm 
Masters Degree in Mongering!

Joined: Sun Jul 29, 2007 4:28 pm
Posts: 705
Like I said, I'm not telling anyone not to go to Colombia. After all, in a city like Medellin with a population of 2.4 Million, there's only 895 people killed every year. Your odds of getting killed are about 1/3 better than that of getting aids from unprotected sex with a high risk partner.

Edit: odd, this is the url to this thread.. not sure how that happened, but the correct url is here now
http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a3_373.html

37 per 100,000 of getting killed in ColOmbia, 100 per 100,000 of getting aids via unprotected sex with a high risk partner.

:P

Kind of puts it in perspective...


Last edited by TheMadGerman on Mon May 26, 2008 11:06 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 55 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next



All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:



Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group