www.CostaRicaTicas.com

Yo all ye Ball and Chain Counselors.\,

Just announced marriage of my old heartrob of years ago

The most beautiful woman it the Universe-, a Latina Magnifica --- Gina Lollapalooza , I mean Lollabrigida , at age 79 is marrying a Spaniard Javier R., age 45 . 34 years her junior.

She turned the tables on us old timers with the young Ticas.

Hell, I am " Deeply Involved" with my favorita Tica 40 years younger than me, and playing around with backup 'relievers' 45-48 years younger

What is this world coming to, in the words of the Guru Circus

Cyg

Great insight as usual Jazz, but I think that the newness or playful part of a new relationship only lasts a year or two. Three, if your really into each other. The sex, especially for men, seems to become routine after the first year no matter how attractive the woman is. Most women seemed to get wrapped up with the "family thing" and being a mother, so the sex aspect almost becomes a non issue for them. Of course with both people working outside the home these days, it only strains the relationship further.

Devo

_________________
The most dangerous adversaries are the ones that come with a smile instead of a sword

One thing to keep in mind is that this is an INTERNET poll. I'm not saying that gentlemen in their 60's are not computer savy, but just not as much as the younger "internet" generation. I see a lot more than 13% in HDR.

Just catching back up with this thread. Dave does raise a few good points and here are some of my responses to them. First of all, when he refers to the joys of having Ch*ldren that raises another whole set of issues, but if you look back at my post that is the one exception where I was a big advocate of marriage. As for all the other things Dave mentioned, companionship and all that crap (just kidding, thats not all crap), my point was you shouldn't have to tie the knot with a woman to be able to get that in the present. As far as what you get in the future, you shouldn't have to do it either. First of all as far as that future old age aspect goes, the odds are well less than 50-50 you'll still be together by that point anyway whether due to early death of you or her, divorce, or being still together but unhappily married and leading largely seperate lives (a status for which there are no clear statistics but which I suspect pushes that marriage success rate much lower than 50-50). So are you going to risk a messy legal and financial nightmare for the offhand chance that it MIGHT benefit you 20 or 30 years in the future. And if you have to tie the knot with someone to insure they'll still "love you" that far in the future, what sort of love is that really. If you really love each other and you don't grow apart (another thing that often happens), then she'll still be there married or not (but will you). Secondly, if hanging out with some fat old lady (albeit with other redeeming qualities for an old man no longer able to get it up anyway) is your goal for old age, then it shouldn't be a problem to find that type of companionship since old women outnumber old men by a large margin.

Al the things Dave mentioned can be experienced without marriage if you really love each and are committed. Not getting married is just a realistic recognition that even the most "in love" couples far too often don't stay that way and in those cases having an awkward legal entanglement artificially hold you together is not the best thing.

oops - double post

Prolijo,

Good points to ponder. You mentioned "Why not just live together?"........Keep in mind, you're getting back into that "common-law" marriage quagmire mentioned about a dozen posts ago on this thread.

I feel every young man should get married at least once and have the experience.... have a Ch*ld or two. If it works out.... fine, if it doesn't, why risk getting back into it? As for me, being alone has certainly not been the worst thing in the world...it suits me fine.

Zebra

As someone who is in the successful 50% bracket of marriage, I feel a need to address a few things.

First of all, the concept of being alone is baloney. No one lives 'alone', unless you happen to be a yogi meditating in a remote cave in the Himalayas. Human beings are social animals. We seek company, the company of men for camaraderie, and the company of women for more intimate encounters. Yin seeks yang, yang seeks yin, it's hardwired into our bodies and our psyches. I've practiced Buddhism for a part of my lifetime and they have retreats where they lock you up in a room for a day, week, month or more. They also have 'dark retreats' where they lock you up in said room in the dark for periods of time. You quickly find out how well you do alone with yourself. You soon discover that your mind will drive you crazy, and we seek distractions from the obsessive barrage of mind via entertainment, friends, p*ssy, sports,etc. So basically the notion that the fear of being alone driving one to marriage is too narrow minded IMO.

So it is really the amount of time one spends and the level of commitment one has with another that is really at issue here. I think the issue regarding marriage, from what I've read previously on this thread is coming from several points of view, overt and covert:

1. I agree with others, that some are made for marriage and some are not. Some people are made to be single, no doubt. More power to everyone, based on their inner characteristics.

2. Immaturity - my feeling is that some guys have simply not developed socially sufficiently to handle marriage, using the badmouthing of marriage and gringas as a defense for their lack of social capacity.

3. Narcissism - some guys simply haven't developed enough beyond a selfish, narcisstic existence and haven't a clue about loving someone.

4. Fear - opening up to others means dropping one's armor and defenses, and becoming slightly or greatly vulnerable. For some guys, this creates an inner conflict, a fight between the sense that love (which is in part true vulnerability) is not 'manly'. For others, there's a fear of the loss of power by being vulnerable to a woman. And of course, the fear of getting one's heart stomped on, often based on past experience, keeps one from opening up again in their life. And a mongering lifestyle created a life situation where that is possible. Again, the badmouthing of marriage and gringas could be masking this fear, or a bandage around a previous vulnerability 'burn''.

4. Break time - some guys, coming out of difficult relationships, find p*ssy palace in SJO and other places a dream come true, having one's cake and eat it too! Some make it a lifestyle. Some will get tired of it and try to find a lasting relationship. Then get burned again, back to mongering, and so on. Some find fulfillment and the relationship works for a long period of time.

5. Lack of risk taking - here we have a bunch of guys who fly to foreign countries, putting themselves at high risk for robbery, kidnapping, murder, STDs, HIV and god knows what else, but shiver at the notion of being in the 50% failure group of marriage, or even the thought of the risk of being in love, dependent or vulnerable with someone. Seems a bit funny no?

6. Impermanence and death - sooner or later your LTR or marriage will end. By divorce, separation, death of your lover or yourself. In all these cases, pain and suffering will occur. It's part of the package. Some are willing to enter into LTRs and marriage despite this reality. Some don't want that pain. Most folks pretty much avoid thinking about death.

7. Practical marriage issues (read: money) - no man, including me, likes the ways the laws are setup regarding marriage/divorce- mainly because men, for the most part, are the bigger bread winners in the pair and have more to lose. That's probably true in 95% of the cases now, but this will change in the next generation.

My basic point that there seems to be so much fury and anger at marriage, LTRs and gringas on this board and others, that it sets off yellow and red flags in my mind often. IMO, there are other issues breeding underneath the surface besides the bitchiness of gringas, lots of unfinished business in the psyches of my fellow dudes. But, still, we do need a place to vent our frustrations with women, who, by all means of scientific and technical analyses, are basically insane.

I also feel the issue is not gringas specifically, but the basic battle of the sexes, which is often a power battle, which is universal. How many of you have done well bedding wealthy Latinas or Asianas? They have the power of money, just like us, and boy, they ignore me as profoundly as any gringa.

Another point is that no form of relationship, even non-relationship, is perfect - it will always have negative aspects, a shadow, etc. Some do not want enter a particular form of relationship to avoid the negatives, but will not have the joy of the positives (and there are plenty of both, from my experience). Those are choices we have to make and live with.

Philo - I loved gringas...until I discovered Latinas. When I think back, however, I shudder how much time and valuable youth I PURGED, just like bailing a boat full of water. But instead of water being chucked overboard into the infinite, it was my PHUCKING LIFE!

There. I feel better now. Let me fix my tie.

Does that mean I regret my 20-year association with my second wife? Hell no. She was the love of my life, no question. And my first wife, to whom I was hitched at far too young an age, gave me a son who's now 25, has 4 businesses going, and is on fire. He's also married with 3 little ones. To each his own.

But as you correctly noted, long-term shit eventually ends, and then there you are. It's perfectly normal to assess it all at that point and wonder if perhaps another route would have brought even more enjoyment and satisfaction. Marriage costs something. For some it's terribly expensive. For others, it's fatal; afraid of a move to live without, they settle with years of dissatisfaction and take up drinking and other self-destructive diversions. And have you ever noticed how couples who've been together a long time treat each other? I haven't known many couples married 35 years plus, who aren't a study in horror.

I'm sure there are immature guys here you refer to, who can't handle strong women and commitment. Many make the case that shagging poor third-world girls is an ego boost for said gentlemen. But I don't subscribe to that nonsense. In the end, it's all about choice. Rich girls in the States choose to hook, and poor girls in San Jose resist it their whole lives. And as for girls being "pushovers" here, well, it's just not the case. That's a very simplistic, stereotypic way of describing this population.

I think the reason guys talk about "bitchy gringas" is because in general, they are. As far as sex goes, it's no surprise to anyone our society is a repressed one. I'm a product of it. When I was 19, I was totally phucked up about sex thanks to my dysfunctional parents, school, and the phuckin church. Here, 19 y.o. girls enjoy incredible sex without hang-ups. They regard it like breathing.

Perhaps there's a degree of "venting" going on here, but I think there's an equal amount of "wisdom," too. Know what I mean?

_________________
"Don't never trust a woman, till she's dead and deep....One day she'll say she loves you, next day she'll throw you on the street."

"...and if men didn't have this unquenchable desire to have sex with women, then they wouldn't have anything to do with women at all. I certainly wouldn't..."

Zippy, Prolijo,

I was hoping to get one of you to do a debate type posting on the positives of marriage even though you don't believe that way. We know the negatives as they are expounded on by almost everyone here. Both you two are good debaters and I bet you could find a lot of legitimate reasons to overcome many, if not most, of the negatives here. Consider the following website.

http://www.adherents.com/misc/marriage.html

An individual mentioned that you are not truly alone. Please call up Meals on Wheels and other of its like and ask them of the amount of older single people out there that the only people contact they have are when their meals are delivered.

Please understand that I believe everyone has the right to find their own happiness in relationships whatever form it takes. I just hate to see the young feel that mongering is a life time of fun and excitement without the accompany host of problems. I feel that I have some insight as I started mongering when I was 17 and it is now 35 years later.

Have a Great Day,

Dave

JM, I would say that what you describe is not a function of marriage per se, it's a function of the unexamined life. Similar parallels can be drawn to lonely, isolated, depressed single people - that is just a different type of horror... There's a really big dance that has to occur to not make any LTR into a deathful rut and it seems that most people can't or don't want to walk those steps. And in any relationship or life, the dark side and negative traits can be found.
You're about the same age as me - I guess you missed the sexual revolution like I did, perhaps we were just a few years too young, or in the wrong circumstance. But my wife didn't and had a wild time, like a 19 yr Braziliana. I wish I knew her then (and some of her friends)!

But isn't it great that you're peaking now instead of 19 years old? There's plenty of guys stuck in various situations, who can't get their butts to SA, LOS, etc., often for financial, emotional and responibility reasons. Like all those jocks who got the good looking babes back then who now are old and fat and are detailing your car and mine, like Biff in Back to the Future.

I, for one, feel extremely fortunate that I will not have regrets in my old age and on my death bed surrounding the lack of great sex in my life, I suspect in contrast to a lot of other guys. Like yourself, almost all of my fantasies have come true, wth much younger women. Awesome! Perhaps we're making up for lost time from our youth, or simply refusing to live with the baggage of repression in our psyches.
Absolutely, this board is wonderul in that regard, in contrast to most other boards. But I just had to point out that some venting is just as much about the person venting than the object of the vent.

I just wanted to say Hola to Philo and Dave...two distinguished gentlemen!

Pura Vida biaaches!

_________________
GG
"Last time I said no......I misunderstood the question!"

A couple of quick reactions here.

Zebra,
That is a good question and I don't have a good answer. Common law marriage is part of the antiquated family laws that are designed to protect the women. In some cases they really need to be protected. For example, look at all the knocked up and abandoned ticas in CR. But in many cases its hard to see the justification for it. If you lived with the a male room-mate for, what is it, 18 months and you split up, you wouldn't be expected to have to make a financial settlement unless perhaps there were things you bought together. As it stands now, with CL laws in some places, the difference between just living together vs. getting married becomes moot.

I also think the second part of your post makes a lot of sense. Maybe marriage is something everyone should try at least once in their lives. Unfortunately, I think a lot of people try it the first time when they're too young and that is a big part of why the divorce statistics are so high. In those cases, you probably can't draw as many conclusions about marriage and perhaps should give it another try.

Philo, philo, philo,
I find some of your comments to be extremely judgemental about those who choose to remain unmarried. You also seem to be confusing the concept of LTR's with marriage. I never argued against LTR's only the institution of marriage. If as you say everything eventually ends, and often that end comes with some pain, then you're absolutely right that is just part of the package, but why not enable it to end as simply and as painlessly as possible. Marriage as a legal and religious institution has evolved to deal with social realities that in many ways don't apply in modern society the same way they used to. First of all, the concept of a lifelong commitment was not so farfetched back in the days when most people died at 40. But is it natural for 2 people to stay in love for 60 years? It happens, but not that often. Another reaon for marriage and the traditional family unit, was the need for two people to partner with one party bringing home the bacon and another raising the Ch*ldren and an institution that binds them together to maintain that partnership until the young is old enough to go forth on their own). Today you have 2 income families with childrearing delegated to some day care center. You also have many many single parent homes. I think we need to find some new paradigm, since marriage doesn't seem to work like it used to. Marriage was also designed as a mechanism to defend the "weaker sex" (or at least the sex that was more handicapped by a male-dominated society). This is why you have divorce laws (alimony, Ch*ld custody and support, etc.) that favor the women. And yet nowadays it is not uncommon for the woman to earn more money than the male. So in that sense marriage and its protections for the female are not as necessary as they used to be.

Jazz,
Sorry no particular comments for you except a thanks for sticking up for the guys who monger as not just being a bunch of dysfunctional selfish insecure narcissists.

And last but not least, Dave
You said this is not the best forum to get an objective view of marriage and on that you are undoubtedly right. But I would counter you are not the best person to comment on the institution of marriage in general either because your own marriage is highly atypical. I have to wonder whether you wouldn't feel more like some of the other guys here, if your wife wasn't so open to your "outlet" and you had to either sneak down to CR or else live in quiet desperation.

As for getting me to debate the positives of marriage, I'll have to leave that to guys like you and Philo as I don't see many positives in it. I HAVE spoken highly of marriage in certain situations especially if one plans to have K*ds as most couples do. I also see a place for it in more traditional societies where women are still expected to give up their careers, stay home and take care of the house AND take care of her man in bed, as women need special protection in such situations, though I think it would better if those societies just joined the rest of us in the 21st century and gave women equal rights (OTOH, apart from the sex thing how hard is it to cook and take care of a house if there are no Ch*ldren? sounds like a pretty cushy life for the women). But, I just don't see it for childless couples in a society such as ours that increasingly provides lots of opportunities for women. The other thing that I will concede and which I clarified earlier is that (except for the CL issue) we shouldn't confuse the merits of LTR's with the institution of marriage. I just don't see why one shouldn't be able to enjoy most if not all of those supposed benefits of marriage you mentioned earlier without getting formally married.

One last comment regarding your meals on wheels observation. I don't see what that proves. Are you saying all of those old people who live alone, ended up that way because they never mrried?! I'm sure most of them were married at some point and either divorced or widowed. If anything that just supports my argument that marriage is no guarantee of companionship in your twilight years.

Prolijo,

Fair enough about the meals on wheels and your other comments. You know that I respect your opinion. I was sitting here earlier thinking about circumstances where couples have been together for over 50 years and a situation that a friend of mine has. In the first, my mentor and his wife have been together over 51 years and he is presently in a wheelchair with health problems. He wife enjoys every moment of being with him and taking care of him. He is five years younger than she is at 84. Love does last. The other more funny example of how marriages work is that I have a friend who is married with two K*ds. Both parents of the man and women are divorced and have remarried and been together at least eight years. The K*ds have four Grandparents and four Step-Grandparents. Another group that clearly indicates one marriage that didn't work out led to other more successful marriages.

If I had a business partnership that was fruitful to start with but failed to changing of attitudes and the requirements of the job and then I lost it all, would that be cause not to enter into any other business partnerships in the future.

Please read test of my statement. I wasn't indicating that I had the insight about marriage but about mongering. That was the context of the 35 years of mongering. I do have insight on that. I wouldn't begin to compare my atypical marriage as that would be dumb. I hit the lottery as to marriage and I realize that every day of my life.

I appreciate you all allowing me to be contrary here with no negatives.

Have a Great Day,

Dave

Dave you wanted to hear some more of my twisted pinheaded logic so here I go .

We all know how fun this mongering gig can be. With abundant Spunk effectively flying everywhere it is a real trip to say the least ! It is fun not having any real responsibility in dealing with a woman having to try to please her 24/7 while being able to mount her but I still believe a great marriage can not be beat for the overall long haul of life if it is with the right two people involved.

Reading between the lines of many of our postings what stands out a lot too me are most men are yearning for some type of real true relationship with a woman. It is only natural we want to be the special one to someone someplace at sometime. This is evident in how many men here continue to try to make or convert a whore into a regular girlfriend or even much more idiotic a wife ! Look how many men want the Latina to spend the whole night with them. Is this just for the sex to hit it again in the morning like so many men talk about or are they just desparately wanting someone to hold in their arms all night that won't run off from them so quickly ?

I hear a lot of men whine & bitch about how bad women & marriage is or was. When I look at some of these guys what I see is a far different picture than what so many paint. I think most of us get lazy (both men & women) & we simply will not put out the effort it takes to keep things running smoothly & in the right direction.

I do see some things that can make a huge difference in keeping things together. Most people I witness do not do things in a very logical real manner. They have hot sex one week with some hot gal & off to the alter they go. People are so impulsive then they wonder why they are having so many problems at some later date.

The hardest thing to do is find someone that you can grow with instead of grow away from. I think men age better than most women on average so marring some 10 to 15 years younger than you is a big plus. Having your finances in order & staying in control of this is a great help. Never let the women take this job over or over your dead body. I believe you need to set the tempo & example of keeping yourself in shape & desirable. Take a good look in the mirror & be honest (hard to do) & if we have room for improvement acutually take charge & do something about it instead of just making excuses.

I would let the women know this is imperative to a healthy relationship that we maintain ourselves or else. Also I wouldn’t want a woman that is very insecure & clings all over you trying to smoother you. They will never let you have any breathing space to work your own kinks out from time to time.

This helps defeat depression at its source while both people retain more mutual respect for each other. The Gringo society has lost its foundation of things I believe & keeping it simple really does help.

Once you have a great positive relationship rolling it just makes these problematic lying Putas look so disgusting. Obvious most men too me like the quality & comfort of something real for their core life much better I feel. Hot loose women will always have their place for some crazy fantasy fun but if we are honest with ourselves we know this will get very old as all the truths unfold. Much easier to play the fantasy game knowing you have a solid situation to retreat to.

It is obvious that one can not hold that bliss together of when you first touched each other but that gets replaced with better things many times. Trust is huge & having someone you can always count on is great. Sharing things in a good relationship with like interest where everyone gets excited is another big plus. We really don’t spend that many hours in the bedroom that this should be the most important part although this part has to be fulfilled.

Over all I feel that the steady state of a good marriage far outweighs the peaks & huge valleys of a mongering life. People I do believe live longer & healthier if they have a better sense of overall well being. If in a bad marriage it totally changes of course. I would think we all want to be at peace with contentment when we are older. Who wants the rat race of a bunch of young conniving meaningless women around that you know only like you because of your $$ when you are older to deal with as your main course?

The easiest way to deal with P4P ladies too me is when they are really not that important to you or your life. This way it is hard for them to phuck things up in your life. You are using them as much as they are you & everyone just simply walks away satisfied. When men are lonely is when they try to make something stupid happen out of an impossible situation. You deal from far more strength playing with P4P types when you have a solid foundation under you.

Marriage is such a tough situation at times since people do change over time. It pays to be a good psychologist at times to feed the one you love the right things to help keep her on track. You really do need to read correctly when things start getting out of line & deal with keeping everyone happy before the damage becomes irreversible.

I really do feel most people just get tired & lazy and it becomes just easier to blame each other than sucking it up & working at things. Once people become bored it just makes it all to easy to quit & this is why people need to do the daily work it takes to keep it together. We need excitement & newness at times so I really believe in being spontaneous with unpredictability even being a little crazy but in a fun innocent way.

Something that has helped some couples I know that were having problems is to get out the photo albums of what put this relationship together. It is all too easy to forget your past of when you both were so young & attractive. This rekindles many old flames for some & lets them see the light as to what really has more overall meaning.

It is sad to see really good people get slightly off track & then they get with some hot new puta chica that just clouds his real judgment even further . One thing I have experienced is it is much easier to substitute one for another with effective rewarding sex than it is to substitute one for another with an effective rewarding relationship.

Just from what I read about so many men here it just seems many are very bitter about their bad marriages & ugly divorces that they can not even think in terms of another one. This is surely very understandable & once older it would be hard to risk or even find something decent out there. This again stresses to me to take your time & really put the effort & homework into getting it right the first time.

We have more tools than ever to use to come into contact with far more females than ever before. It is up to us to use them wisely. After living this life out & being in a situation where I deal with a “High Volume” of people & their problems it appears to me 40 to 50 % of all people are a real MESS mentally so I would avoid these types like the plague for a real relationship NO MATTER WHAT! You can not change messed up defective people for the better. They only get worse over time & drag you into their hopeless quagmire .

I guess if I was in one of these marriages where the woman just didn't have it in her to keep herself respectable having those thunder thighs & huge ass that scares the hell out of you in the morning I would hit the eject button faster than a fly jumps on a pile of shit !

I think my overall take on marriage now is it is more suited to those that want a family. The Ch*ldren I feel really do need the feeling of total commitment behind them even if it is somewhat of a facade. As far as adults go that don’t want Ch*ldren I see little need for the contract. It simply does not hold people together as has been proven a billion times over.

In many ways this contract is the beginning of the end for many. So many people have what I consider to be the totally wrong concept of it all. They simply use it as a means to their lazy manipulative ways. How many couples do we see that use this contract as a license of ownership or a license to abuse or steel from one another?

The big fallacy of marriage I consistently see are that people feel they finally caught the one they wanted so now they don’t have to work at maintaining themselves anymore. How many men do we see go for the third PORK CHOP with all the gravy piled on top after marriage. The women seem worse than the men anymore with gaining weight. The expression “fat & happy” seems awfully out of place too me.

I hear women more often than men want the contract as a sign of commitment where it is harder to up & leave making people try to work out their differences. I have the feeling if there isn’t a contract & the couple just live together might keep people more honest about keeping themselves in the same condition as when they first met. ONE THING FOR DAMN SURE IN THIS LIFE IS THIS CONTRACT IS DEFINITELY GOING TO WORK AGAINST THE ONE THAT HAS THE MOST TO LOSE ! Hum, duh I wonder who this might be ?

The original design & concept of marriage I feel was great but leave it to modern greedy money motivated man to phuck it all up ! The more we have so called advanced the more complicated it has been made with forever more games being played. It is now to the point where many of us have just given up & are now looking Southward for our happiness. For God sake to give ourselves a chance lets keep it simple !

The best world is both worlds too me with the main emphasis on what really counts. One just helps to balance the other but you better plan this all out at the get-go & then hope the force is with you !

_________________
"Run silent, run deep"
Spunk glazed Chicas are the building blocks of the universe!

Zippy,

Thanks for your thoughts. I think marriage is what you make of it and too many man concentrate on the look of the gringa and the sex aspect of it. Believe me, I know that it is the most important thing in a man's life but it isn't the most important thing in a woman's life. Is that wrong of the female? No, that is her body and hormones. Why do we beat up the females for not wanting sex when their honest desire and God given thoughts leaves sex as only something to have to do? They have about as much chance of faking sexual interest on a continual basis as we men have in faking that we DO NOT want sex.

I made a deal early in my relationship with my wife and any man can use the internet to make the same deal. My deal is that I would at least get off once a day even if it is only a quickie and I would support and take care of her for life. We have both made good on that deal to date. Just ask and you just may get the same deal. You can ask easily on the internet with no downside. How about something like, "I am a sexual man and I need sex daily. I will agree to love and support you if you will "service" me daily." Be direct. It is funny that so many will be direct here as to their dislike of LTR and marriage but won't have the communcation skills to get across to a possible partner what their needs are.

Have a Great Day,

Dave