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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 12:11 pm 
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Thanks to Papichullo for a great analysis - never would have figured all that out on my own. I actually like the way Chase crossed up everybody's expectations and ended the show ambiguously - a lot of times with popular entertainment we expect everything to be tied up into a neat little bow, but to me this was far more interesting and haunting.

Only complaints - I wish there had been far less AJ and far more Meadow in the final episode and last season in general, and I can't stand hearing a Journey song ANY time... :roll:

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 12:42 pm 
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Papichullo wrote:
Tony was killed....

in fact, the ending was genius if you've paid attention to the show or are just a fan of well developed well thought out plots that all tie together and have the memory of a champ to remember it all the ending was simple, he got killed, but let me tell yall why and explain in detail...

There was 3 people in the room total who had a reason to kill tony.....

the two black guys, they were paid before to kill tony but he was
only shot in the ear, this was in one of the earlier seasons,

also in the earlier seasons, the trucker who was sitting at the bar stool, who the camera kept focusing in on, is Nikki leotardo, Phil Leotardos nephew, he was in one of the early season episodes where Phil and Tony have a sit down....

heres where the genius comes in....

When tonys walking in the diner,you see the camera focus on him, then it switches to his perspective, and you see him looking @ the booth hes gonna sit at...

then the camera switches back to tonys face, then it once again
switches to his perspective, and it shows him looking @ the door and looking @ the people come in..... Everytime the door opens the Chimes sound....... Carmela walks in, Chimes, AJ walks in Chimes, this is when Meadows parallel parking, still trying to get inside the restaurant....

at this point the camera switches back to the trucker who goes in the bathroom......

Then it goes to a scene where meadow finally parks and starts running in the diner.... the doors about to open, Tony looks up....

and No Chimes......................

No Music............

Everything just goes black...............

In one of the early episodes of the sopranos, tonys talking with
bobby about what it must feel like to die..
Bobby says "at the end, you probably dont hear anything, everything just goes black"

Part of that was revisited in the second to last episode during the last seconds of it, when tonys about to go to sleep and he flashes back to the memory of him and bobby on the boat... "You probably dont hear anything everything just goes black"

So in the end, the Journey song was playing, the chimes on the door sounded but when meadow came in, the guy in the trucker came out and killed tony...

Its the reason you dont hear or see shit when he died.... it was
from his perspective.... and everything went black, then the credits rolled.


All of that sounds great. But what happens when all the actors in the series find trouble finding work since most of them are typecasted by the series and they call chase and he says we can do a movie and make millions :?

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 1:02 pm 
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I have to say many of us in the NY / NJ area were very disappointed with the final Soprano episode then I just read this article that is really unbelievable how they pulled so many older persons into the final scene nobody even recogizined but a keen eye by this writer puts it all in perspective.

Quote:
Phil Leotardo Gets it in Sopranos' Finale


restaurant scene left to the imagination BUT TONY IS DEAD!!!!






The much-awaited conclusion of HBO's "The Sopranos" arrived last month in a frenzy of audience speculation. Would New Jersey mob boss Soprano live or be killed? Would his family die before his eyes? Would he go to jail? Be forced to enter witness protection? Would Brooklyn boss Phil Leotardo, who had ordered a hit on Tony, prevail?

In the end, the only ending that mattered was the one masterminded by "Sopranos" creator David Chase. And playing against viewer expectations, as always, Chase refused to stage a mass extermination, put the characters through any changes, or provide his viewers with comfortable closure. Or catharsis. After all, he declined to pass moral judgment on Tony—he reminded viewers all season what a thug Tony is, then gave him a pass.

But Chase was true to himself, and that's what made "The Sopranos" brilliant on Sunday night, and the 85 episodes that went before. The product of an artist with a bleak but illuminating vision, "The Sopranos" has always existed on its own terms. And it was seldom tidy.

The only goos part in the finale was that Leotardo was crushed. Otherwise it was perversely non-earthshaking—just one last visit with the characters we have followed so devoutly since 1999.The end of one of my favorite shows of all time!

Of course, Leotardo (Frank Vincent) hit a dead end after Tony located him with the help of his favorite federal agent. The execution was a quick but classic "Sopranos" scene: Pulling up at a gas station with his wife, Leotardo made a grand show of telling his two young grandchildren in the back seat to "wave bye-bye" as he emerged from his SUV. The next moment he was on the pavement, shot in the head.

Then you heard the car roll over his head. Carunnnchh! Quick, clinical, even comical, this was the only violence during the hour.

Not that Chase (who wrote and directed this episode) didn't tease viewers with the threat of death in almost every scene.

This was never more true than in the final sequence. On the surface, it was nothing more momentous than Tony, his wife, Carmela (Edie Falco), Meadow and A.J. meeting for dinner at a cozy family restaurant.

When he arrived, Tony dropped a coin in the jukebox and played the classic Journey power ballad "Don't Stop Believing." Meanwhile, every moment seemed to foreshadow disaster: Suspicious-looking people coming in the door or seated at a table nearby. Meadow on the street having trouble parallel parking her car, the tires squealing against the curb. With every passing second, the audience was primed for tragedy. It was a scene both warm and fuzzy yet full of dread, setting every viewer's heart racing for no clear reason.

But nothing would happen. It was just a family gathering for dinner at a restaurant.

Then, with a jingle of the bell on the front door, Tony looked up, apparently seeing Meadow make her delayed entrance. Or could he have seen something awful—something he certainly deserved—about to come down? In fact, the ending was genius if you've paid attention to the show from the begining, in fact Chase tied all but the return of the Russian lost in the woods inside that final scene in the diner. i believe Tony is dead and here is the reasons...four in all. that's how many were in that room who had reason's to whack Tony.

The two black guys who entered right at the end were paid to kill Tony when his mother put the hit on her own son in the first season.

The trucker st the booth, who I thought was the Sporting Goods store owner who Tony ruined in gambling, but he was the brother of the trucker that Christopher killed in the DVD robbery. we last saw him when he was identifying his brother's body.

And last but not least the guy that walked into Holston's in front of AJ and sat at the counter was Nikki Leotardo, Philly's nephew. He was on an earlier episode when Tony and Phil had one of many sit downs.

Here is where Chase is a genius....Everytime someone came into the diner chimes would sound, Carmela walks in chimes, Aj walks in chimes, this was all while meadow, his daughter was parking, not very well but she did finally get parked, Tony should have gotten her one of thos self parking Lexus'.

Then the camera switches back to Nikki going to the bathroom as Meadow is rushing across the street to get into Holston's and Tony looks up and ....

No Chimes....

No Music....

Just a black screen....

Remember one of the earlier episodes Tony spoke with Bobby about what it must feel like when you die? Bobby said"at the end, you probably don't hear a thing, everything just goes black!" This idea was revisited in the next to last episode when Tony is about to go asleep as he thinks about Bobby and him on that boat after the Monopoly game brawl.

So in the end when jopurney was playing in the diner and Meadow came in, someone killed Tony!!!!! Bada Done!

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 2:24 pm 
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So...the question now comes up..what did the Sportsbooks do? Did they pay off Tony Dies or Not? Or inconclusive evidence? Could be a good argument either way? :shock:

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 2:30 pm 
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NYG wrote:
...But what happens when all the actors in the series find trouble finding work since most of them are typecasted by the series and they call chase and he says we can do a movie and make millions :?

Exactly! Stay tuned for the movie, to be released in '09.....
MG :wink:

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 3:28 pm 
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The fact that the guy goes into the bathroom infers hes maybe going to kill Tony coming back out, but you will never now. Chase is trying to be an artist everyone now has their own interpretation/impression of the ending because he left it so vague. Also this leaves an opening for a movie, and more money so in chases mind the wierd ending accomplishes two goals, a)more money with movie sequel and b) he is considered artistic daring and rebellious. Personally I hate the ending but I understand why he did it, its the last thing everybody expected, how rare how artistic....Barf


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2007 8:58 am 
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And last but not least the guy that walked into Holston's in front of AJ and sat at the counter was Nikki Leotardo, Philly's nephew. He was on an earlier episode when Tony and Phil had one of many sit downs
That's not true, the guy at the counter that went to the bathroom had never appeared in a previous episode and is a "mystery man"- http://www.phillyburbs.com/pb-dyn/news/ ... 60360.html
And also the 2 black guys, well Tony did kill one of them. :?
The whole Soprano family in the greasy spoon diner seemed unrealistic and completely out of place for them IMO.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2007 9:08 am 
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"The Ending!" Love, hate it you have to give David Chase credit. I think the ending has created more discussion then I can ever remember any other TV show ending ever doing.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2007 9:25 am 
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Irish Drifter wrote:
"The Ending!" Love, hate it you have to give David Chase credit. I think the ending has created more discussion then I can ever remember any other TV show ending ever doing.


Exactly. And that's what he wanted, to confuse everybody with all these supposed tie-ins so there would be discussion. It was a total letdown IMO. Sorry way to end a great show by trying to be artsy-fartsy instead of just giving us a solid finish.


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2007 9:46 am 
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Orange wrote:
Irish Drifter wrote:
"The Ending!" Love, hate it you have to give David Chase credit. I think the ending has created more discussion then I can ever remember any other TV show ending ever doing.


Exactly. And that's what he wanted, to confuse everybody with all these supposed tie-ins so there would be discussion. It was a total letdown IMO. Sorry way to end a great show by trying to be artsy-fartsy instead of just giving us a solid finish.[/quote

That is what he was looking for. Create a situation where the viewer can take out what they want and guess. While always saying that he has the ability to bring Tony back because we never saw him die. What other person on that show did we not see die? Only Adrianna but we at least heard the shots. That is why I liked it, that is GENIUS 8)

NYG

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2007 11:16 am 
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Irish Drifter wrote:
"The Ending!" Love, hate it you have to give David Chase credit. I think the ending has created more discussion then I can ever remember any other TV show ending ever doing.


Yes, exactly, now all the discussion around the different interpretations of the ending has officially validated his ending as artistic. Thats exactly what Chase wanted to be validated as, cant fault him for it.. he accomplished HIS goal.


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