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PostPosted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 9:54 am 
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You may want to read today's www.amcostarica.com


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 10:05 am 
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That's why I'm a bit of a hard ass and my posts reflect it... 80% of the gringos down here aren't strong enough to avoid getting eaten by these sharks... So when I hear this mamby pampy, sensitive feelings shit it just leads me to believe that the poster is just another lamb waiting to be lead to slaughter. If you are gonna play, you better play hard ball just like the Ticos do... If you try using logic or sensitivity you are gonna get burned.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 10:45 am 
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Do you guys who live down there ever see this type of stuff in Tico Times?

It seems A.M. really reports viable info wether a gringo scam or crime. Kudos. And a good post to you for putting it here for us to read. Thanks.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 10:51 am 
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No, Tico Times never prints this sort of stuff... AM CR does keep us informed on this type of thing though..


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 11:59 am 
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Thirdworld wrote:
That's why I'm a bit of a hard ass and my posts reflect it... 80% of the gringos down here aren't strong enough to avoid getting eaten by these sharks...


Very true... People don't realize just how helpless a foreigner can be when it comes to a legal battle against a tica.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 2:36 pm 
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A few things hit home in the article. The major one is the age of the guy.
The second is the line about how he provided "training" to the tica that will last forever. That says she is probably not even 25.That is what is asking for trouble. Never, ever, hook up with someone with that great an age gap.For anything but an hour or two. She has probably been playing him all along.

The other obvious failure by the gringo was a lack of police officer friends.
If you are going to be living anywhere in the world, befriend your area police officers.And thier bosses.Make donations to the police charity, shake thier hand,etc. Then when this type of thing happens, you simply call your police officer friend.The paperwork will get lost and ex-wife and maybe novio as well will get a lesson about conducting themselves more considerately. Calling a lawyer does nothing in any place but the US.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 3:10 pm 
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Wise advice, MrLV. A friend on the force may be the ultimate "bro before ho'". :D

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Last edited by Pacifica55 on Mon Mar 02, 2009 6:54 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 3:42 pm 
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It's just sad that the people who need to heed this advice the most won't listen to it.....

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 3:45 pm 
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It can happen to anyone, anytime. Once I wanted a girl out of my apartment in Rio. She wouldn't go and picked up a floor lamp and started slinging it around. I talked her down, but it wasn't pretty, and not before she did some damage and threatened to call the police...

You just never can be 100% certain in life...

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 4:43 pm 
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MrLasVegas wrote:
The second is the line about how he provided "training" to the tica that will last forever. That says she is probably not even 25.That is what is asking for trouble. Never, ever, hook up with someone with that great an age gap.For anything but an hour or two. She has probably been playing him all along.



I do not think the wife was very young. If you read the article carefully it says the daughter broke in while the wife was at the court hearing. The daughter then told the police that the gringo abused her and her daughter.

Later on when he went to file a complaint they told him perhaps they could write up the wife's daughter for damaging his property by breaking the lock on the door.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 5:21 pm 
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Well... One thing that AM Costa Rica didn't talk much was background on how this couple met and got married. I would assume based on the article that they are either poor Latin trash - or they are women from the trade.

The other thing I didn't understand was the man's "advanced age." Since when is 71 years old, so old that you cannot distinguish between your own ass and first base??? Not clear on that...

More probable.... too many rum an cokes and fantasy land.

Finally, the reaction from the clerk who took his complaint is just wonderful. Was she trying to she that it was perfectly legal for a woman ( with whom he is NOT married) to throw him out of the house??? However, it is illegal to break locks. I hope that was lost in translation.

What about trespassing???? This bitch should have never been in his house in the first place!!!! Sheesh!!!!

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 6:18 pm 
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EXECUTIVE SUMMARY: Article from the Tico Times about the CR Supreme Court overruling certain parts of the new domestic violence law. Paragraph on why there is a genuine need for SOME SORT of law in that area. Paragraph on why at least one of these parts really was so problematic. Paragraph on how raging feminism in CR is swinging the country too far in the other direction. Final section is on what we can do to prevent such things from happening to us: 1) "never buy when you can rent", 2) consult with a lawyer if you do to protect yourself legally ahead of time, 3) don't live with her for very long and still take legal precautions and 4) don't rely solely on the law to protect you and make friends with authorities ahead of time so it never gets to court.
========

I'm not sure if this has been posted about before but I came across this interesting article in the Tico Times from last October showing that there is SOME hope:
Tico Times wrote:
The Constitutional Chamber of the Supreme Court (Sala IV) late last week rescinded two articles of Costa Rica's Law to Penalize Violence Against Women, ruling them unconstitutional, citing vagueness in the wording of both.

More than 100 men were released from prison late Thursday following the court's decision.

The much-contested articles 22 and 25 address criminalization of “maltreatment” and “emotional violence.”

Article 22 punishes perpetrators of physical violence against a woman by anyone “with whom she maintains a marital relationship, whether a declared union or not,” a crime punishable by six to 24 months in prison.

Article 25 criminalizes “anyone who repeatedly, publicly or privately, insults, devalues, ridicules, shames or terrorizes a woman with whom she maintains a marital relationship, whether a declared union or not,” and is also punishable by six to 24 months.

The law has been criticized for punishing male abusers differently from female ones, and conversely for protecting female victims differently than male ones.

The case was filed by public defender Marco Feoli Villalobos.

Just over 70 percent of men imprisoned under the law since it was passed in May 2007 have been convicted for crimes specified in those two articles, according to the National Institute for Women ( INAMU).

After eight years in the legislative process, the law passed, with 45 of the assembly's 46 members voting in favor. Several male lawmakers, however, stated after the vote that, despite perceived problems of unconstitutionality, they were afraid to vote against the bill for fear of being labeled machista, or male chauvinist.

INAMU called the court's ruling a “serious step backward,” and its president, Jeanette Carrillo, called on various government agencies “to fulfill their promise to safeguard the physical integrity of women in situations where there is a threat of violence from their partners.”

Many lawmakers, including former Vice President Laura Chinchilla, who lobbied for the law while a legislator, were mum on the court's ruling.

In 2004, a series of events highlighted the lack of adequate domestic violence prosecution laws, including one case in which a Costa Rican woman was granted asylum in the United States after demonstrating that she was unable to be sufficiently protected here against her partner, who allegedly violated a restraining order on him over a dozen times.
source: http://www.ticotimes.net/dailyarchive/2008_10/1020082.htm

Incidentally, that was followed up by this related article:Marchers seek to revive women's law ruled unconstitutional. Maybe someone else can provide info on more recent developments regarding this law.

Why there is a genuine need for SOME SORT of law in that area: Now, don't get me wrong I'm sure that there is a serious problem of GENUINE domestic violence against women in CR and SOMETHING definitely needed to be done about it. HOWEVER, lets get real, the problem is almost entirely from abusive, machismo ticos (who often drink to drown their economic struggles), rather than from elderly gringos, who have been whipped down by years of US-style feminism, and who "mistreat" their tica partners with material goods and a lifestyle that they would never have been able to enjoy with a tico. Every time a tica ABUSES the new domestic violence law with these ludicrous made up charges they do a disservice not only to their gringo victims but to all their tica sisters who really ARE abused because they make a mockery of something that was well-intentioned.

Why at least one of these parts really was so problematic: I've always had a problem with that Article 25 provision in particular. “Anyone who repeatedly, publicly or privately, insults, devalues, ridicules, shames or terrorizes a woman with whom she maintains a marital relationship, whether a declared union or not ...” If someone REALLY is abusive of someone else IN PUBLIC, there will usually be witness that can verify what happened, whether it is physically or just emotionally. If someone is seriously PHYSICALLY abusive of someone else, whether it is in public or private, there will usually be some form of physical evidence like a bloody lip or a black eye. And even if a woman is seriously EMOTIONALLY abused even in the privacy of her home, again there is usually some sort of evidence such as the shouted insults of the guy being heard by the neighbors. HOWEVER, I don't believe this law as written said anything about the necessity of corroborating evidence (evidently not if this guy wound up being evicted). AND that part of the law was so vague it went TOO FAR the other way leaving INNOCENT guys vulnerable to any bogus charge some crazy or vindictive or greedy tica might dream up about things he ALLEGEDLY SAID in the PRIVACY OF THEIR OWN HOMES. If the burden of proof is on the ACCUSED, how is one to defend themselves and prove a negative in such situations?

How raging feminism in CR is swinging the country too far in the other direction: I'm sure CR has needed improvements to the status of their women in lots of areas from employment laws to Ch*ld support to domestic abuse, but it now seems like the hens are ruling the chicken coop, with the likes of this former VP Laura Chinchilla, SJ Mayor Maureen Clarke and Jeanette Carrillo & Mayrene Sánchez (both of INAMU). If they weren't all such strident feminazis they'd be looking at how to improve the law by correcting its more questionable part while still preserving its power where it is genuinely needed, instead of organizing marches to scare male legislators into backing flawed legislation. Another area where this can be seen is in their petty harrassment of MP's and other adult business over bogus code violations instead of improving the economy, which is the REAL problem, and making it so that so many women wouldn't feel they have to work in such places.

What we can do to prevent such things from happening to us:

1) Obviously, never marry someone who is so much younger than you and from such a different background because, as much as you'd like to believe it is all about pure love, in reality it will always be in large part about what you can buy her (btw, this tica may have been old enough to have an adult daughter, but in CR that still means she could be half the age of this gringo). And, if she'll marry you for that, you have to ask yourself what else she might do. Never "buy" when you can "rent". Clearly, there are many so-called "M-Men" around here who take a somewhat different view, so I'll offer several alternative approaches.

2) Even if you THINK it is about pure love, try to set yourself up legally so that this, or something like it, can not happen so easily to you. In the US, we increasingly have prenuptial agreements. Nobody goes into a marriage expecting it to wind up in divorce, but from a practical standpoint we know that a large percentage of marriages do wind up in divorce so we prepare for it. And these are for marriages between generational and culturally compatible people. Why would you do anything less with a young chica, even one you love and think loves you?

3) The law applies to all types of "domestic partnerships" ("anyone with whom she maintains a marital relationship, whether a declared union or not,” That seems somewhat vague. Clearly if you're formally married it applies. It also seems to apply to "common law" marriages which are the result of living together for 3 years or more. It might help to limit your cohabitation to under whatever that limit is. Most gringo-tica relationships usually don't last much longer than that anyway, or at least not the "good" part of it, and by the time the deadline approaches it is probably a good idea to send her packing and start looking for her replacement any way. Unfortunately, as written the law MAY also apply to any "undeclared marital relationships" (whatever that is) regardless of duration. So it would still be wise to cover all your bases whenever you allow a young chica to move in and live with you in a "marital-style" way. BTW, the article at the top of this thread didn't mention how long the old gringo and his tica were together.

4) Any talk of legal remedies may be moot anyway. I don't think the law was really written with bilking gringos in mind as much as it was meant to target abusive tico esposos, but that is the way it is being used by some ticas and, at least in this case, effectively. In the tico view, we've got deep pockets compared to them and they're usually even less sympathetic towards an old fat gringo shacking up with a young tica. Why not give the poor tica the benefit of the doubt over the rich foreigner? So I think MrLV's advice about cultivating sympathetic friendships with the local law enforcement is a very good one and an investment that could pay off for you in a variety of situations.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 6:35 pm 
I can do CR without a wingman!

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Well said pro,
I think the take aways are try to befriend the local police at a higher level, and then never by real estate in CR, first of all its a rather illiquid market with poor records and high levels of corruption with common title problems etc.....but the icing on the cake is you create an incentive for people to scheme to take this asset away from you. In addition rents are so low that owning with a mortgage payment is way more expensive than the monthly rent and you arent looking at much capital appreciation on your property. And lastly you may tire of CR after three years and opt for a new venue like Colombia or elsewhere when they close down the DR with the new lady, and then you will not be able to sell the property if it hasnt been commandeered from you already. So in conclusion dont rent. If it flys, floats, or flirts or if its foreign property....RENT.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 7:36 pm 
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That's a good point Hunter. I was using that "Rent instead of Buy" only in the metaphoric sense as it applied to marrying vs. dating, rather than to actual real estate but what you said is true for all the reasons you said. Even without having a chica living in your home there are many good reasons for at least holding off any real estate purchase. However, this case illustrates why that becomes even more advisable if you take in a tica "roommate". If you get forced out of a rented apartment by law, I don't see how they could hold you liable for further rent (though with crazy CR laws anything is possible - another question to clear up with a lawyer beforehand). However, you'd probably be screwed much worse if you were kicked out of property you had paid for and be out for your whole investment instead of just a deposit.
=====
BTW, how do you guys like my new format for my longer "rants" :wink: :lol: :P I'll try to keep it up.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 8:15 pm 
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This story tells me that there is a lot more to the story than we are never going to know. Concur with Pro's advised caution.

Men are at BabesMomma's mercy in most societies to some extent and I guess that is how it should/must be. We seem all too willing to breed and run in many instances.

CR is not running solo in the phuck-daddy game. In Washington State, if you live with a woman and assume the role of father you can be held responsible for khild support even though you can prove you are not the father, even if you never slept with her. In many states, men have one year from the time they are named as the father to disprove paternity, even if they are never notified that they are the lucky winner. They are then accountable for support regardless of paternity.

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but your love don't pay my bills,
I NEED THE MONEY!" - John Lee Hooker

Disclaimer: The above is merely the opinion of the author unless specific scientific data is included.
Your mileage may vary. https://costaricaticas.com/phpBB2/viewto ... 978#206978

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