www.CostaRicaTicas.com

Dwayne,

Valid points all. By the way how'd you know I paid cien? (I'll be lynched now!) The point about her being suspicious of a quick offer of cien is something that occured to me in hindsight. Still...

The taping incident sure couldn't have helped matters.

It might well have been a combination of both that caused the money-up-front request.

That's all.

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Chica Chaser

For the record I have locked less than 10 threads in over 2 years.. I think that goes towards an open board.

I lock threads when
1. Threats or flaming begins
2. topics turn political
3. The original poster requests it to be locked down or deleted.
4. When I am inundataed with PM's requesting one to be put to bed.
I am sure there are few more but I can not think of them right now.

I can say for certain a couple of the above have happened and the original thread was killed. I see no reason to kill this one if it is kept in good spirit. I will not let one thread ever hurt the overall scheme.

Hope that helps.

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Thank you for supporting CRT!

Ok thanks. Good to know. As I don't claim to read this board regularly or completely I was unaware of the low number that have been locked.

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Chica Chaser

Yes glass houses very fragile & very unstable with a mix of the blame game & it really gets interesting. I have blamed guys for messing up my time because they were better looking & younger. I mean if they hadn't come to CR I know all the chicas would have been on me for 1/2 price.

Here is one part that many men are guilty of in the HDR. Some guys just whip out a camera & flash I am in it on the other side of the bar & no one asked anyone’s consent at all. But if I don't like it I should not be there at all. But I accept this because it goes with the territory. Anybody else have this happen. You are not suppose to take photos in HDR but it happens a lot. What happens if your mug gets on the internet this way & the wife sees some Chica was all over you?YIKES!

The Chicas could care less about CRT all they want is their money as quick as they can get it & either go home or find more money. If any thing I believe we are of less value & more trouble to them if they see us organized. I rather be the independent negotiator than being categorized as one of those hard to deal with no cien type of men. That may keep them away from you more than you think. It is really better I believe if CRT is invisible to them in HDR & KL. Let us organize & educate ourselves here but not advertise it. Better too be the fox in the hen house isn't it?

Dwayne

This made me wonder? How many Putas or P4P are working in a day in CR & what % of Latinas are doing this type of work? The population is around 4 mil I bet at least it would be 2-3% of the female population has had some P4P in there life just from what I have seen. Would be interesting to know 2% would be 40,000 women. Just guessing anybody knows of any true #s?

CC,

I thought cien was mentioned earlier on this thread. If it doesn't say cien earlier then I got mixed up with another thread.

I was just throwing some ideas out there. Kinda thinking aloud. I'm glad to see that CC and El C got it and understood where I was coming even if they may not have agreed with all my points. I would like to add a few followup comments to address some of the counterpoints presented.

First, I don't think it is necessary for them to actually come here and read the posts or even to see our membership cards. Whereas most mongers that come to SJ hang in solo or in groups of 2-4, they see CRTers hanging in larger groups or walking around seeming to know many of the other guys there. They may not know CRT but the can at least guess we might part of some sort of group. Many have also heard of CRT, if not by having visitied it then by being told by some CRTer or other chica. If they see you with other well-known CRTers like VB who seems to know half the chicas in the BM or hang with TMan at Kamur they can probably guess you're a CRT'er too. Its obviously not nearly 100%, but probably more of these chicas know that there's some sort of association of guys if not the name than you might expect and if they do they also often can figure out which guys are part of it. Besides, we do flash our cards when we go to places like Kamur and ZB and given the number who have posed for TOM I'd say its a rare ZB or Kamur girl who hasn't heard of our group. Perhaps I'm giving the BM girls too much credit, but I don't think that is a huge exaggeration.

OTOH, whether you buy the above argument or not, I think CC's second point is much more significant. Even if there were an issue of what sort of image CRT has with chicas, what could we or should we do about it. We could try to put more teeth into enforcing it, but how would we fairly apply it and what would stop guys from trying to go around it? Nothing really.

NOW DWAYNE,
Where do I even begin. Man you really need to take a class in logic as your thinking is usually so twisted.
Dah, exactly there are far too many guys who from some twisted attempt to curry some sort of favor with a chica or some other unfathomable motivation show them the photos. And, right, lets not argue with how many have seen the pictures, they probably are relatively few, but thats all it takes. The chica net works well and the word gets out to even those who haven't seen it themselves. Maybe not 100% given the new girls that float in and out of the business but certainly with the core group that has been there for any length of time and has connections with their fellow chicas.If you really believe that you have the morals of a snake. Based on that argument any guy that really only wants a picture for his private collection shouldn't always be able to take it because the girl can never trust him to keep his word. Or how about this? She shouldn't be so stupid to agree to be paid after the act even if the guy promises he will. At some point one said or the other has to be able to have a little faith in the basic integrity of the other party. When that faith is violated the ultimate onus of responsibility should be on the person that lied not the person that believed him. Even if you do want to blame the victim, you can hardly compare her sin to that of the cheat. You just don't seem to get this and you probably never will. Another specious argument. I can only assume whatever I'm looking at was done consentually. I wasn't there. But like the chica who poses for a pictures based on assurances how those pictures would be handled, I can only operate on the assurance of the poster that he has gotten proper consent. Sure some of those pictures may have violated those standards but I have no way of knowing which ones or even knowing for sure if any of them have. Comparing that sort of situation with those of the guy who knowingly violated a chica's trust and actually made the inappropriate post is no where near the same thing.That most guys in CR have never heard of CRT is a given that has never been disputed. Chicas are something else. Highschool drop-outs yes. Completely ignorant no. Within 100 yards of a computer, well seeing as though there are at least 2 that I know of in the HDR lobby right next to where they sign in to go upstairs, that is patently absurd. I frequently see chicas (inlcuding nicas and colombianas) doing their e-mails and more than a few hear routinely receive the RFM's from chicas by e-mail. So question if you will their awareness of CRT, but don't think for a moment that they are all somehow too stupid to get on a computer. And whats with the puta comment? Between your apparent acceptance of this guys right to victimize these girls, your low regard for their intelligence and your usage of disparaging terms, you're own values and willingness to judge others.

BTW, you keep saying its okay to take secret videos as long as its only for personal use. That is rationalizing. If its okay to do, then do it openly and ask her. If you don't ask her and you get caught expect her to be angry and suspect the worst. How does she know what you will do with the images? You just said she should suspect the worst and maybe because of guys lying to her or hiding cameras she should. You said that there are all sorts of reasons why a girl can be untrusting. And that is true, but incidents such as this certainly go directly to that issue and are probably a large part of that particular concern.

Now Zippy your turn, You may accept it, but clearly you don't like it and think it is wrong. Was that supposed to be an argument in favor of this guy's right to do what he did? Also forget about the few rare guys that snap pictures in the BM, what does that have to do with you taking pictures of chicas? Its not the chicas that are taking pictures of you. What did they do to deserve that? Security cameras cover every inch of that place and they don't bother to hide that fact. So you've already basically consented to being recorded as soon as you stepped in there, albeit not to being posted on the internet. Plus its a public place and hardly the same thing of having nudie shots or even shots of you performing intimate sexual acts taken in a private room where no camera is expected or visible. You go in with the expectation that she is not going to take pictures of you that she will post someplace where your wife will see it. Shouldn't she be able to have that same assumption? Its called being mutually discrete.This is an excellent point and could very well be the ultimate argument as far as this issue is concerned. In fact, you should note that I listed this very thing as the 2nd negative in my list. I think that there are both positives and negatives to having a CRT "brand name". This is a powerful argument for keeping a lower profile.

Prolijo now your turn

My

Is just another example of why people should be careful & think about what they do before they do it? But I am giving it as a real world example about how inconsiderate other people can be because their actions affect other people’s lives inadvertently. I did not state it to be hey they did this to me so it’s OK for a guy to do that to her. I said I do not like what he did but giving another example of situations that exists that happen without consent so this is pretty easy to see unless someone wants to take it different I would thing. I don't thing we are to far apart here unless we want to be.

I think we should use this site to educate & prepare ourselves to extract as much joy as we can muster in a trip. This site allows us to maximize time and pleasure with most mens limited time for vacation this is the true value I see not one to control behavior of others & put rules & shackels about. The true beauty of CR too me is that it is unorganized. I would hate to have to have a monger code to live by & the Prostitutes have a hookers union it would destroy the carnival like atmosphere I believe and start wiping the free wheeling smiles off of all the players faces, this is one area I disagree with you but disagreements are healthy to me because it stimulates healthy deeper thinking about an issue & this is where new ideas are born & to me that’s wonderful.

Zippy,
I agree and think we are realy close on this.

The first paragraph I agree with completel. If I understand you correctly, you were actually ciing that as an example or argument against doing to chicas what sometimes gets done to us.

The 2nd paragraph had me going ah huh, the purpose of this sitte is to educate. But when I got to the part about controling behavior of others and putting rules & shackles, I hesitated. I don't really see what I was talking about that way. First of all I don't see it "controlling" others behavior, only guiding it. As has been pointed most people are not members of this board and will do whatwever they want. Of those that are members of this board they still will have a choice. They can still act in an "ungentlemanly" manner if they so choose, that doesn't mean the rest of us should want to or have to associate ourselves with guys tha act that way. There already is a gentlemen's code of behavior towards one another here. What I was throwing out was the idea of extending that code more clearly to how we behave towards the chicas. A code that most of us follow anyway. I was also throwing the question of whether we as a group have a right to decide who we are going to associate ourselves with as a group. Is it going to be based just on who pays $39 or registers an e-mail address or will the criteria be more stringent than that? Basically we already have some minimal standards - pay your money, don't flame others etc.. The only question I really added is how far over do we draw that line. Finally on this subject I would hardly characterize what I was referrring to as rules and shackles. As I said before what I was talking about are rules most of us follow already and the only rule I ever mentioned was the Golden one. Don't do anything to a chica that you wouldn't want her to do to you. Is that so hard?

Finally, I got to your closing remarks and my complete agreement returned. I was just throwing these ideas out as something worthy to be discussed. I readily acknowledged when I posted them that I didn't expect most people to agree.

Prolijo your

Maybe shackles was going to far but you refer to reprisals or punishment in the above quote set but standards of other mongerers which is like a bucket full of leaks too me. This rule I always live buy anyway it comes natural for me : Don't do anything to a chica that you wouldn't want her to do to you. Is that so hard?

You don't know me because I am so private but the Chicas know me well. They all talk like crazy & mainly about who is the big spender & sucker to come to town. But they also talk about who is a good time that keeps his word and who you never have problems with & I have heard this feed back about myself. Other newbies that start seek the advice of Semi pros & pros & when they give them the green light about a guy it helps because they are less familar with things & more nervous, I don't even have most ask for money upfront because some chica has told her he is always nice & helps people. I have had one of my friends who of course speak their language perfect. He said this one Chica told her friend you are lucky he likes you. Let me tell you that gets you mileage plus in the room under the covers.

The big reason is simple they can relax more knowing they will not get jerked around. I am nothing special average guy in good shape but I have build a re pore with them & that goes a long way because I am not paying them but the average going rate. This helps also from not arguing about price which is another mood buster.

The point here is not to say I am wonderful because I am not but to show the extras you get from good conduct & a good reputation. Do shitty things to the Chicas expect a shitty result that simple!

Mysterious video-taper:
Please threaten me also.

I will be glad to make time in my schedule so that you can 'educate' me.

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It is cheaper to pay now and get it over with.
It is also easier to get them to leave.

Zippy, Dapanz1, et al have pointed out the following in the past, but I think it's important to reiterate and emphasize the following...

NEVER UNDERESTIMATE THE (BM) CHICAS NETWORK(S)

Word gets around there in a hurry.

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"In a nation ruled by swine, all pigs are upwardly mobile, and the rest of us are phucked until we can put our acts together; not necessarily to win, but mainly to keep from losing completely"...Hunter S. Thompson (RIP)

Zippy, and anyone else who views any proposed code of conduct as being either unnecessary or too restrictive in an atmosphere that's supposed to be carefree...

1. We all play by certain rules in C.R. as it is. When we play toot, rummy or blackjack, there are rules. Fixed prices are themselves "rules;" you "obey" the rule when you pay the stated price for your beer or gallo pinto. Rules are part and parcel of society, so that people can get along better. Simple, right?

2. At no time did I call for any kind of enforcement. My suggested Mongers' Code had more to do with a sort of cinematic self-portrayal; if each of us subscribed to the "rules," we could integrate these rules into the roles that we play when we're in C.R.

In C.R., we don't have to continue playing the CPA, pharmacist, plumber, electrician or minister we play at home. All of us, even dumb old unemployed me, play a different character when we land at Juan Santamaria Airport.

I look at the mongers' code as being sort of part of the script for the "role" I play in Costa Rica. Yes, I do negotiate firmly but with humor and politeness. Yes I keep myself clean. No, I don't act violently/abusively toward the girls. Yes, I get my CRT brothers' backs if they need it, offer help to newbies, comport myself as a gentlemen.

I've seen a lot of knee-jerking in these recent threads. "No one is going to tell me what to do, 'cause I'm a badass big boy with bucks..." or whatever. No need for all that. Some rules are actually enjoyable to follow, "Thou shalt take your time so as not to rush the hour" might be a good example of a fun rule; this rule simply reminds us to enjoy something slowly. Neither it, nor the "rules" proposed in y Mongers' Code are meant to be restrictive. They're meant to help us enjoy the time in C.R> more fully, enjoy better interactions and reputations with the chicas, etc. Not as a group, but individually.

Now to a bit of flaming. Admin, please forgive me in advance, but I need to make this public, as I might need the help of other CRTers to spot and avoid this gentleman:
Duane, I hope never to meet you in public. Your obvious lack of regard and respect for fellow human beings ("putas"), your inability to logically process argument and make logical assumptions, and your stubborn insistence that what was done TO this girl BY one of us is somehow okay, all make me sick to my fat stomach. No, I won't buy you a drink. No, I will not get your back, even if you were being butt-raped by the Morazan Park trannies. No, I won't actively seek out anything you have written on this board. I get a strong feeling that you and I simply have irreconcilable differences in thought, education and plain old golden-rule manners. Sorry for the brief flame; I just want everyone else to help me steer clear of this guy, because I'll not see him coming.

The way each of us comports himself while in Costa Rica may have little effect, but it will have some effect on the game as a whole. Our behavior can either be the grain of sand which irritates or the emolient which soothes and lubricates. Even if the lubrication we bring to the game may not be copious, it will help things slide better. A little dab'll do ya...

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Pura Vulva! Wandering through the dark, I am El Ciego.

Now gentlemen. I have sent PM's to just abot everyone involved in the this long running saga.... I ask all of you at this point for the last time and I mean that to let this thread go.

I have had enough of it, so have the majority of our CRT brothers. I will not ask politely again.

I stated before if the thread is going to be about monger ethics and you are bringing new stuff to the table so be it. But the same handful of individuals making the same statement back and forth between each other, followe by the flames that are beginning, well it is growing tiresome based on now that I had to clean out my inbox 54 PM's requesting this be given the old heave-ho I should just lock it down.....

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Thank you for supporting CRT!

Admin,

Actually, this thread has taken a number of reasonable turns and seems to no longer be about the incident per se but about the attitudes and behavior of some of us in a variety of situations. I can understand your impatience, as it seems that a dead horse is being repeatedly beaten here, but some new things and ideas have emerged.

However, if it's really pissing you off, please do lock it. Discussions of "monger ethics" can continue elsewhere, right? So don't suffer this anymore, Admin.

Shut the sucker down.
And no, I don't resent it when threads are locked...unless I've started them! :wwink:

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Pura Vulva! Wandering through the dark, I am El Ciego.

I second Zippy's suggestion. The weather outside the gulch is tremendous and the people are a lot less likely to involve you in their daily dramas. BTW, a famous man once said, "Honor among prositutes is like rank among Lieutenants; there isn't any."

Think outside the gulch!!!!!