www.CostaRicaTicas.com

GetRhythm, is right on target. The easiest way to avoid Beggars is stay away from the Gulch. I have only stayed at the Presidente 2 nights on my trips, and that was simply for the experience. The vast majority of my travels have been outside of San Jose and I can tell you the beggers decrease exponentialy the further from the Gulch you get. If you have the cash there are many hotels that I promise you no beggars are around. I normally stay at the Melia Cariari, and have yet to see a beggar there, but will keep looking. Of course if mongering is your only goal then this type of spot can be a burden, especially since it is a good 15-20min from the gulch.

Also, since about 80% of my time has been spent on the coast, the problem is even less. I had no concerns walking around Golfito, Puerto Jimenez, Pavones, etc. small towns in the south, at 3-4am with a Tica.

Anyway, not trying to denegrate the problem, but if it is a problem for anyone it can be avoided.

How many guys HERE on THIS board are REALLY going to go to CR and NOT spend at least SOME if not a LOT of time at the BM or anywhere else in the Gulch. You can pick a hotel outside the Gulch but you're STILL going to end up there at some point anyway, so all you'll be able to do is MINIMIZE having to deal with the beggars but never eliminate it.

Not to mention you're just trading one disadvantage off for a different one of having to take a cab to go to many of our favorite haunts. OTOH, the worst areas for beggars happen to be at 2 of the most popular "Monger" hotels in the Gulch - the Rail at the News Cafe and especially the front doors of the HDR. One can minimize having to run these gauntlets without having to leave the Gulch area altogether. The entrance to the Morazon sometimes has beggars too, but nothing like the HDR. The areas in front of such places as the Amon Plaza and the SL are nearly always "beggar-free".

The ironic thing is that many newbies take the exact polar OPPOSITE approach of what you guys are suggesting. They prefer to actually stay at the HDR itself, mostly for convenience but partly in a way BECAUSE of the beggars outside. They cite the insecurity of the city streets in general based on what they see outside the Del Rey doors and because of that they stay at the HDR so they don't have to even leave the building, let alone get out of the Gulch. Of course even they have to leave their hotel sometime and as a result are probably even more often subjected to the beggar annoyance than those who stay elsewhere. And, even more ironicly, it is exactly those cien/hora spending newbies that probably end up giving money to the riffraff which in turn draws them to the HDR/BM doors in the first place.

I happen to agree there is something to be said for staying outside and getting outside the Gulch for a whole VARIETY of reasons, one of which is the beggars, but that by itself is not enough of reason. If you're going to spend a lot of time in the Gulch anyway, there are alternative solutions that minimize exposure to beggars but that don't put you far away from the P4P attractions that draw us there to begin with. One SHOULD reduce their visits to the HDR/BM as much because of the increasing preponderance of hardened putas inside who are spoiled by the overspending gringo newbies that stay there as because of the beggars outside its doors. One should explore other P4P options outside AND inside the Gulch for the same reason. And, IMHO, one should get outside the Gulch to see all those OTHER attractions that draw all the mainstream tourists to CR and, as importantly if not more so, to get out to meet and get to know regular Ticos.

Well Prolijo I agree with what you have said, and I didn't want to get into the whole "Why stay in the Gulch anyway" thing. I lucked out my 1st trip, although perhaps it isn't luck, and hooked up with a hot, smoking hot, non-working girl outside of the gulch. I took one tour of the Del Ray after I was with her and wondered why I should pay some used Tica $100 a night when I spent 2 weeks getting it for a nothing more then a nice dinner and a trip to some store amounting to far less.

I think the equation works out very simply. You go to high touristy areas you get beggars. You go to other areas, you don't. if you don't have the intestinal fortitude to leave the confines of the gringo areas, then you get to deal with all those areas offer. If you do, well, you get to deal with more pristine areas, with new and even more fun problems, but less beggars. It is all a trade off, but such is life. That is why it is so much fun.

Crack K*ds posse seems to be growing from my observations last week and he's really not a little K*D any more. I guess he is around 14 or 15 now.

These K*ds will probably be a real danger in the near future. With all the glue or paint they're sniffing who knows what dangers lie in the near future from them.

They always seem to popout from nowhere too.

My advice would be Crack K*D is not just a K*D anymore.

Cali

Cali,

My point exactly. The problem of the beggars in some ways is more than a simple annoyance that can be completely ignored or avoided. No matter how much we try to get out of the Gulch, the vast majority of us are going to spend at least a portion of our time there and, even if we manage to avoid the HDR/BM altogether (still unlikely), we're probably going to have to deal with some street characters elsewhere in the Gulch. The best solution would be for the authorities to do their job and drive off the riffraff or provide social services for them so they don't have to bother us (I won't hold my breath), or, failing that, local businesses such as the HDR and the Prez extend their security further out around their periphery.

But, more on your point, what will some of these characters end up resorting to when they don't get sufficient "donations" for their fix? The problem of beggars in the areas we frequent is in some ways related to the problem of pickpockets, theives and even strong-arm robberies. Sometimes the relatively innocuous seeming characters graduate on beyond merely annoying people and some are there already (not just "in the near future"). The use of accomplices or small crowds of cohorts to distract gringo targets while others move in for the kill is not at all uncommon. For example, when a disgusting old street woman steps in front of you as you walk down the sidewalk and starts pawing you as she pleads for money (or a date or whatever ) its hard to just ignore it and its easy to miss her friends stepping up behind you no matter how seasoned and street wise you may be (even in front of other Gulch places like the Morazon, just ask Circus).

I've been fortunate enough to avoid this type of thing but I know other vets who have not been so lucky. When there are street characters around me, whether it be beggars, lousy street musicians, vendors pitching crap, private taxistas (who sometimes act as spotters, just ask Don Gordo) or lowlife looking people hiding in the shadows, my street radar goes on overdrive. I may seem to be ignoring these people as I quickly move on, but actually I'm always ACUTELY aware of them. It is always far more pleasant to be able to walk around and not constantly have to worry about such things. Despite what others say here, when I walk from say the HDR/BM to the Barrio Otoya areas, my stress level is always MUCH higher when I walk through the concentrated throng of street riffraff right outside the HDR doors than while walking by the parks where I can see people coming and at least have some time to react.

I would very rarely give them a handout, but on numerous occasions
while walking between the DR and the KL with favoritas, the Ticas would nearly always give them something. Of course it was actually MY money
that the chicas were giving them. I think many of the chicas have empathy for them, as most of them have offspring and either have lived or currently live in abject poverty.

_________________
"In a nation ruled by swine, all pigs are upwardly mobile, and the rest of us are phucked until we can put our acts together; not necessarily to win, but mainly to keep from losing completely"...Hunter S. Thompson (RIP)

There are beggars in that area, albeit very few. On a couple of occasions
before and after eating at Antonio's, a very upscale restaurant between
the Cariari and the Herradura, I've was approached by beggars (a man and woman together). I know Admin1 and a few other members have eaten there. Granted there are very few in that area, but they are there.

_________________
"In a nation ruled by swine, all pigs are upwardly mobile, and the rest of us are phucked until we can put our acts together; not necessarily to win, but mainly to keep from losing completely"...Hunter S. Thompson (RIP)

Beggars:
It is 8:58am and I am at the DR. From here to the PR are 6 Beggars. Just out the door of the DR are 5 Vendors. Yes this is more than in the past.
Lee

GT,

You're right about the chicas sometimes giving them (your) money. I think one of the things these beggars play on and why they seem to target us even more when we are with a chica is they know whether we WANT to give them money or not we OURSELVES are far more likely to give in when we don't want to appear cheap to our "date". But I've also met many BM chicas that are just as annoyed with these guys as I am.

Of course, many chicas have some empathy for those unfortunate enough to fall into such a pitiable condition. I DO TOO. The difference is I recognize that offering them a handout and enabling their behavior is NOT the best way to help them. Just try explaining that to a chica though when all you speak is broken spanish.

I have been going to Costa Rica for almost three years and the beggers are now worse than ever. Last night around 11PM as I was walking back to the presidente from the Blue Marlin I felt unsafe for the first time. The beggers are more numerous and more aggresive, and also there is no police presence.

Taxman:
Firedude and I were thinking the lack of Police is a big part of it.

Lee

on my last trip,I decided to ignore them and not speak or acknowledge them,they will still follow you and throw empty cup's and stuff at you,especially the youngest one's..............

Do they still follow you from the BM all the way to the Morazan? I've had a few that would do that. They would not quit until I actually entered
the Morazan's doors. Granted, it's not that far, but you would think they would quit after you've said NO a couple of times.

_________________
"In a nation ruled by swine, all pigs are upwardly mobile, and the rest of us are phucked until we can put our acts together; not necessarily to win, but mainly to keep from losing completely"...Hunter S. Thompson (RIP)

Prolijo said:



Probably not too many, but depending on your tastes, it's quite possible to do so and still have a great time. I personally very much enjoy the MP's and strip clubs, and would have no problem filling up a six-day trip just doing those. Not to mention the Europa show as well, which sounds like a can't miss.

Also, if you stay at Sportsmen's (hint, hint), there's reasonably nice and very convenient free agent options available right there on prem a good share of the time.

Beyond the BM and KL, mongering opportunities in the Gulch are actually pretty limited. The only place with any on-site facilities is the Casablanca strip club, which can't seem to get it's act together.

And this:



Actually, if you stay at Sportsmen's or Amon Plaza for instance, all the daytime MP operations are just as easily accessible (some even more so) as they would be from the Gulch. I would even encourage walking whenever possible during daytime - even to the Oasis neighborhood.

As for the nighttime strip club operations - all the most popular (Kamur, Scarlett's, Tango India, D'Pelufo's, Arcadas, Molino Rojo, Le Grillon) require driving from anywhere in the downtown area - so no disadvantage there either.

I may try the BM one night on my next trip, but with the price inflation, decline in chica quality, and rampant beggars, I could just as easily pass.

GR,

I misunderstood your remarks. Personally, I don't consider the SL to be really outside of the Gulch. I understand by a more traditional definition the Gulch only encompasses the few blocks between and around the Prez and the HDR. But to me going just a few blocks further is not really expanding your horizons that much.

My own definition of the Gulch would encompass all the places of interest to Gringo Mongers in the downtown area that are within easy walking distance of each other. That would include the SL, Castillo, NF, ZB and the Amon for the northern fringe (A9/11). The other boundaries would be Avenida 2 or Central to the south, Calle 11 or 13 to the East and extending to the NW to cover the Amon district places as far west as Calle 6. Admittedly, this is a lot larger than the more limited and I guess more traditional definition, but you have to admit this still represents a highly concentrated and fairly contiguous bunch of bars, MP's and other type establishments that cater to our particular interests.

To me "getting outside the Gulch" means going much further than your definition, going to places that usually DO mean taking a cab. Outside the Gulch to me means such places as D'Pelufo, the various places that are south of Parque Central including Molino Rojo, Arcada and further still Kamur, and finally to the west all the Paseo Colon establishments. Even more so, getting out of the Gulch means getting out of the downtown altogether AND the "mongering mentality" and going to places that are not frequented mostly by chica pros and Gringo players, places where one can meet "real" ticos and ticas, the small sodas and market places, or places like the late-nite scene at El Pueblo and the bars of San Pedro. Even more so it means getting out of San Jose.

However, even if one were to use your more limited definition of the Gulch, while it certainly would be possible to avoid the Gulch-Gulch altogether, it is probably still not practical for most of us. Personally, I don't take many chicas out of the BM anymore, but I still enjoy soaking in the scene and chatting with my friends at happy hour.

Actually, essentially you and I were really thinking the same thing. If you noticed my earlier post specifically mentioned the Amon and SL as alternatives to the HDR and Prez that are "beggar-free" but still close to everything. You're absolutely right that they're actually closer to many of the daytime places and that, other than the BM/KL, many of the other night spots require taking a cab no matter where you stay.

The difference is that I consider the Amon and SL to still be basically Gulch hotels. When I think of hotels outside the Gulch I think of places like the Casa Conde, the BW Irazu, Linda Vista Aptos., etc.. Incidentally, I wasn't the only one to misunderstand you as ME went even further outside the Gulch to the Melia Cariari. Those places spare you from beggars but offer none of the advantages of proximity. And, as the recent case of DG shows, staying outside the Gulch doesn't do anything to spare you from other street risks.