www.CostaRicaTicas.com

I believe the Palmas are the short filler version of the Vegas de Santiago cigars. Same tobacco mixture as Vegas de Santiago they just use the pieces of the leaves to make the cigars instead of the whole leaf.

I am shocked that The Cigar Room Shop is on that list from cruzcanelahabanos. They are carrying fake Flor Real's fro Goodness sake, I did not check out their "Cubans" but now I will. If that store is on the list, I do not trust that list.

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http://www.costaricacigarstore.com

Can you answer the question - what Cubans can you provide for $8.50 - and since you brought up Don Ursino's name, I suspect the cigars you are refering to are his.

Another reason smoking "Cubans" can be difficult, as well as expensive.

Short version - an authorized "Casa de Habanos" can only sell Cuban cigars - period - nothing else. The fact that an establishment has an "Authorization" to sell Cuban cigars means, frankly, little - you can still get fakes, as you mention in your post.

I did not want to get into this lest Javaman think it was a "shot" (it would also be nice if he would answer my previous post - and that was a shot ) but the fact remains w/ an authorization, all that means is that an authorized distributor can sell to you - not much else. No assurances that what you are buying is real.

Maybe its me, maybe I can't - or choose not to afford $20 cigars - and maybe its being a long time cigar smoker.......but given the price, construction issues, fact you really need a very repudable seller (and I don't consider the many "mail order" Cuban sellers as that - not that it matters to me, but its also illegal to have them sent to the USA, but it does mean that your cigars can be seized, and you don't have any recourse) - I am amazed that Cuban cigars have the "mistique" they continue to enjoy - to me its just not worth it.

Java, still waiting for the answer........

the palmas afore mentioned were by the box and russ gives a hell of a deal. if these are vegas, then i'll take the palmas over vegas. i think the whole "cuban' authentic cigars is hype from the embargo and seriously like the dominican or costa rica tobacco just as well. i plan to stop into the HLH for a look see anyway on the next CR trip.

The guys running the cigar room now are legit and know the business. They have the import license to bring Cubans in posted on the humidor. They also have a local factory that makes cuban leaf cigars here in CR that are very good for the money. They will actually replace a cigar that burns badly.

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BKTUNA/Boyd
I am never going home

Just for the record, I walked into the Cigar Shop Room, copies the numbers off of 4 boxes, walked into Papis and checked the Habanos Website.

They register. I am very surpised. The labels are either very, very good fakes that someone took the time to match the numbers with an existing product, or the cigars are real.

desculpe

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http://www.costaricacigarstore.com

I trust all boxes I open up myself sealed and tight, BTW anyone who knows me and has any interest I would be happy to share some legit online sites for Cubans in pm or email. Sounds like things are good there not saying different. Just saying what I think and not saying anything there is fake.

Hold down the fort I really need to get a vacation! I mean really bad!

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LOL I would Love to never hear the word game used again ever again! :)

Excellent Boyd. I was not real pleased with the cigars I purchased about a year ago at the HLH; they just didn't seem to be genuine Cubans to me, though I'm not an expert. I brought one back to my friends who are and they cut it open to examine the filler, and the verdict was it was not Cuban. I'm very glad to hear that they are legit now.

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Man I'm living life like a great white shark swimming with minnows! It's all about panocha, great scotch, fine cigars, loud-ass rock music and speed, speed, speed - plus spending as much time as possible in paradise on earth, Costa Rica!

Agreed. There are three Cubans that make my top twenty list. The rest of the list contains cigars from Nicaragua, Honduras, and the Dominican Republic.

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Man I'm living life like a great white shark swimming with minnows! It's all about panocha, great scotch, fine cigars, loud-ass rock music and speed, speed, speed - plus spending as much time as possible in paradise on earth, Costa Rica!

You are 100% correct; its NOT the same thing -

Its a common mistake many make re "Cuban seed" and Cuban cigars - all Cuban seed means is that the cigars were grown from seed originated (smuggled out, actually after Castro came to power and started nationalizing cigar companies - the seeds are very small, about the size of the head of a pin - so it was relatively easy to smuggle out a sizable amount in a small package) in Cuba - I suppose leaf blending can happen - but does not since any cigars containing Cuban grown tobacco can't be sold legally in the USA - which happens to be the worlds largest cigar market.

If you know how the Cuban gov't guards their tobacco (they can sell all they make; why would they sell leaf - even inferior leaf to anyone else?), and how Cuban cigars are distributed (its a great story, but too many hands touch the product before you get to smoke it) you start to get a picture about the main reasons they are so expensive - hint - its not because they pay the farmers or the rollers so much!

There is so much hype and bullshit in the marketing of cigars its not funny - and we can agree that not being able to have something, or something difficult (and expensive) adds to its "aura" - however, its also prized around the world where if you have the $$ you can easly aquire the product.

I believe Cuban cigars are not what they used to be - cigars made elsewhere are just as good, if not better, and with less construction/draw issues - more consistant, too, and certainly as a broad rule, cheaper.

My everyday smoke is a (Dominican) La Gloria Cubana Serie R #6 Maduro (@ $7.40 - 10.00 depending where I buy 'em - expensive enough!) - I also like Camacho. Given the choice of any cigar I would choose a Padron 1926 Maduro or a cigar they came out with in 2000, the Millenium - over any Cuban, because of the issues previously mentioned.

What makes it special - w/in Cuba, a fairly small place, there are 6 unique areas producing tobacco, and the climate, rainfall, soil, irrigation (underground streams) come together to produce a produce like no other - Good analogy might be wine growing regions of France, or Napa.

Cuban cigars are "puros" - not blended with tobacco from anywhere else - and when it comes together righ, produces a peppery, rich, full somke that still is the benchmark for how a cigar should taste Best and worse cigars I've smoked have been Cubans.

I think the Cubans have rushed production, not tended to the fields and put quality control aside to produce - lets face it, they don't have a lot of cash crops to export , but IMO its sinful what they are doing on so many levels.

I sorta agree w/ you re demand once the embargo ends - at first everyone will want 'em - but once they see the pricing, and experience the inconsistancy issues, they will return to their regular favorites.

Also, don't look for any bargins on Cohibas, embargo or no embargo - none in other parts of the world and they are expensive regardless - the Esplendito (sp??) in the big ring gauge size was going for about $750 a box - in Havana, acording to the latest winter 2011 "Cigar" mag.

i find all the "authentic cuban cigar" talk silly. im sure it's because im naive and inexperienced. im listening for: "this cigar draws nicely, well this one burns evenly on a consistent basis, well i bought a... and it had excellent flavor, and this one was burning uneven, etc" i appreciate all the experienced cigar crt brothers helping us out. im partial to padron, padilla, and perdoma because theyre easily available in miami. i plan to get my smoke on in HLH with a fine cigar and some great conversation.

I'm standing corrected...I checked serial numbers on Cuban cigars at some of the better cigar shops downtown and they matched. So my info about the difficulty of importing Cuban cigars and tobacco is not accurate. My apologies.

Its not difficult - just expensive! And you STILL Have to be on the lookout for fakes.

I'll give you the Readers Digest version of how Cuban's get distributed (I may be off a little, but I think I'm 98% correct; this is off the top of my head based on what I've read and been told by tobacco men like Ernesto Perez Carillo founder and former owner of La Gloria)- I'm also truly giving the short version! I don't work in the cigar industry, nor did I ever - I just love them and have done a lot of research):

Cuban cigars are distributed by "Habanos" - As Cuba is under a communist government, Habanos (formerly "CubaTobacco") is in essence controlled by the Cuban government - however, a 50% stake in Habanos is (reportedly) held by Imperial Tobacco, a large British firm.

Habanos sells directly to Appointed Distributors located throughtout the world - these tend to be old, very knowledgeable firms - in many instances their relationship w/ Cuba goes back decades - they have exclusive rights to countries, or regions of the world - one of the best known is the UK distributor, "Hunters and Frankow" (sp) and WAS Davidoff of Geneva - more on Davidoff later.

These Appointed Dist. sell directly to:

Casas de Habanos
Other Distributors in their geography
Certain retail tobacco stores

Some years back, the Cuban gov't came to these Appointed Dist's (AD) and demanded a 50% stake in their companies, as a condition to continue as distributor(s) - as you can well imagine, while they were not thrilled to give up 50% of their business, however it was better to own 50% of a firm w/ the rights to distribute Cuban cigars vs 100% of a company who did not.

(This is their world wide business model - so if the AD for the UK has 50% of their company owned by the Cuban Government/Habanos, you have to asume the AD for CR and Nic. also does - but even Hunters and Frankow does not like to discuss their ownership -and as a private company, does not have to do so).

The "AD's" all aquiesed - w/ the exception of Davidoff of Geneva, who told the Cuban Government to pound sand - then proceeded to burn their entire inventory of Cuban cigars - and no, not one cigar at a time! - in protest saying the the quality was poor and they did not want the association w/ Cuban cigars going forward.

The distributon model is complex - and w/ the exception of the Appointed Distributors, no one legally "buys direct" from Habanos - but it also explains why these damn cigars are so bloody expensive.

Take the example of a cigar purchased in a retail store, and we will put aside the (very real) question of whether its genuine.

By the time you buy it look at how many "hands" could potentily have touched it:

Habanos - who sold it to...
The regional Appointed Dist
Perhaps the AD sold the cigar to another Dist
Who in turn sold it to a retailer - then you.....

So you potentially can have 4 people touch that one cigar or box before you buy it; at the very least, three - and all have to make a profit along the way - so the question perhaps should not be "why are Cubans so expensive" but maybe why don't they cost even more!

PS For a Communist Government, they can be pretty good capitalists when they so choose!

Great Post Scuba1
Correct as I understand it, it only leaves out the gray market where most of the US gets it's 100% authentic Cuban cigars and most are not more expensive than many premium nons.

I was pretty new to Cubans my first trip and bought just about every fake in SJ, I did however have a passion for cigars and have a substantial collection. I belong to several cigar boards which schooled me in Cubans and how to get them. One of them schools I will never know it all, I still learn daily from great BOTL on my favorite cigar boards.

Out of my collection around 20% are Authentic Cubans some very good and expensive some very good and reasonably priced. I hope to get that number to 50% by the time I am out of work and can't afford to buy $10-$20 cigars, I will though always have a supply of aged stock constantly rotating. If traveling best to just bring your own, if not only buy from LCDHs shops and even then if crooked the box codes might be right doesn't mean the box wasn't loaded with fakes afterwords.

In the end the only reasonable way for me to build my collection was to order from reputable vendors I trust. This is often where the gray market comes in and the reason some are very reasonably priced. As I said before there are many nons I like just as good as Cubans but I have to admit the best I have ever had were 9/10 year old Cohibas.

In the end just smoke what you like and if you are smoking and can't tell if it's a Cuban it isn't.

Good Luck All

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LOL I would Love to never hear the word game used again ever again! :)