www.CostaRicaTicas.com

About a month ago Astro posted a poll on novia experiences. While I never voted in the poll, I did reply that I thought the term "novia" was used much too loosely because I didn't consider a chica who was with me mainly because of my relative wealth to be "real" girlfirend no matter how she acted with me. Now, in Astro's view that might make me a LAL guy, but I see myself as really a GFFE guy (Girlfriend FANTASY Experience seeker). I like the illusion but tread carefully not to delude myself too badly or at least not until the point of financial and emotional ruin.

In my reply I also stated that the poll should have been reworded to more accurately reflect what each guy was talking about. So here is MY new poll.

BEFORE VOTING READ THE FOLLOWING CAREFULLY.

First, this poll is meant mainly for the 56% of respondents from the last poll who said they've had 1 or more novias in CR. To balance things out, I've left a special spot for permanent or semi-permanent residents (lets define it as those who spend at least half of each month at least half of each year in CR or any others who have regular extended vacations of a month or more in CR) who've had novias in CR to exclude themselves. While their sharing of their experience is highly valued on this board, it is not representative of most board members, who have far less time to seek out, weed out and woo worthwhile girlfriends while in CR and who are far less likely to be fluent in spanish which greatly facilitates such relationships. Perhaps I'll do a separate poll for them later. I do encourage them to respond and share their prespectives in this thread. Of course any others who have had novia relationships are welcome to participate whether they responded to the previous poll or not.

Secondly, for the purposes of this poll, I'll define novia as a chica with whom one has an ongoing regular relationship which includes at least as much time doing other boyfriend girlfriend things such as dining out, hanging out, dancing, meeting family, going places, etc. as it does sex sessions. I will NOT use my more restrictive definition that factors in the girl's motivation since that is not always easy for the novio to determine.

Thirdly, again for the purposes of this poll, I'll define a successful relationship as one that has lasted 6 months or more and did not end in the classical way of the girl making ever increasing and unreasonable demands for money.

Finally, I'll define non-pro as one to the best of your knowledge has never taken money for sex in a manner that would normally be considered prostitution as opposed to pro's and semi-pro chicas that one normally meets at the DR and similar places.

OKAY, HERE GOES:

I guess I'm obvious now. It has gone on for 7 months and at this writing has not ended badly. Time will tell.

dapanz1

_________________
Paradise= Sitting outside the Bodega in Panama City about 1 am. Drinking cool Balboas with cool friends and blazin' hot Colombianas. I want to be there..RIGHT NOW!

Dapanz1,

I wish you all the luck in the world, bro, but I fear you just don't realize it yet. You did read VB's report on what she was doing and saying behind your back while still in CR and I tend to believe what VB says. She may be back in the Dominican Republic now, but even hardened pros occassionally need vacations from their work. How long do you think it will last (even if you fully replace that lost income stream), especially considering there are also plenty of opportunities for her to earn plenty of extra cash over there the same way she did in CR? Do you really think her family who has been sharing in the proceeds of her labors would either do anything to stop her from returning to her old line of work or to do anything to screw up her potential gravy train with you? I hope I'm wrong, but VB's report reveals she has been hiding things from you already. What other things has she lied about. You yourself indicated that you have aroused suspicions. What sort of basis is that for a long-term relationship?

I think the light has started to turn on but not from anything I have read here. But, the point you make about suspicions is true. What kind of basis is that for a relationship? If you don't have trust you have absolutely nothing. But, most of us lie. Especially on this board. We lie to our wives or girlfriend about what we do or where we go. Are we really any better than the girls? I lost track of what I went to CR to do in the first place. As for the familia, you are absolutely right. Why would mom want to phuck it up? IF she were benefitting. I'm not sure what she could be getting at this time. It sure ain't money. But, if we marry, that could be entirely different. Contrary to what might be believed I haven't sent a kings ransom in money. But, as for now, she isn't on the program in the DR. She is waiting for me to come and marry her. That is fact. But, I can feel the chill on my feet. I suspect if I back out on my promise she will be right back where I found her. If not CR somewhere else. Anyway, I'm tired..tired of talking about it. I appreciate everyones concern if it is genuine and I detest anyones jealousy should they have any. Gracias, tal vez, yo hablo mas tarde. Pero, ahorita, no mas.

dapanz1

_________________
Paradise= Sitting outside the Bodega in Panama City about 1 am. Drinking cool Balboas with cool friends and blazin' hot Colombianas. I want to be there..RIGHT NOW!

Dapanz....yes they all lie. The hard core ones are unusually good liars....and they have this amazing ability to seem like they care about us while they are lying to us.

While my new novia has never been inside the Del Rey I don't K*D myself. She lies. My challenge is to CATCH her at it....make her afraid of losing me for it...and convince her that the ONLY way to keep me is to be truthful with me. It is a challenge...and an experiment. At some point I will post on how well it went....but you can assume that I have already caught her in a lie, and I used it to teach her to never do that again. Will it work? Time will tell.

Every chica scam is designed to do ONE thing. Get More Dinero! It becomes a game to them, and the lies become more elaborate.

Dapanz says:

This question is one that defines you as a GFE guy or an LAL guy. The LAL guy would say...hell yes I am better. She is a whore, and I am the king. The GFE guy will say....wait a minute. How am I better than her? We tend to sympathize with their issues, and empathize with their plight. We may not believe ALL their scams, but we do know their life is really tough and we like helping them out a little or a lot. Hey...don't knock it...it is just what we do.

But let's not K*D ourselves. These so-called "relationships" are NOT real. They are novia-like relationships....or as Prolijo calls them GFFE. Fantasy experiences....not real. So if you want to have trust and a real relationship you are looking in the WRONG place at the Del Rey. You just can't have that if they are working there. Ever....unless the trust means that you accept that she screws 5 guys every night when you are not there and you are cool with that. If that is true, then why have her as a novia anyway....just Phuck her when there, and try to be friends.

The reason to have a novia is to extend that experience further....in between trips. I have enjoyed talking to mine every day since I came back. It is one way of feeding the addiction when I know I can't be there.
It also enhances the next trip, knowing you have made a special bond with a special chica.

Having a novia in Costa Rica is much easier and safer than having one back home. She is not gonna show up at your doorstep and making a scene, cause she can't get here. The relationship is completely on OUR terms. We see her when WE want to, and if we don't want to see her, no big deal. If at some point we get tired of her we just stop calling her or e-mailing her. What is she gonna do? Her demands for money are at least partially controlled by us...and at any point we can just say NO. What is she gonna do...dump us? Cristal dumped me when I said no...then called me a week before I was to return to make up with me. She knew I was coming back and wanted back on the gravy train. Stupid me...I fell for it....but no more.

I again have to add....this only happens when we WANT it to happen. Some may criticize Dapanz for his situation, but I have no doubt he had a blast throughout his 7 months. Did it cost him too much? Only he can answer that. If we are paying them MORE than we think we are getting back....then you get in trouble in a hurry. Eventually the hard feelings that develop allow you to just dump her and move on....hopefully a bit smarter and wiser.

Is Dapanz at that place yet? Only he can answer that. He has already passed that 6 month barrier, but I suspect that is only because he is more patient than most of us.

_________________
ASTROGLIDE

Astro.....

I know you learned alot from your past experience with Crystal including clearing out all water bottles and pens from the room before you get them to the room.

However, I have to bitch slap you a little on point of catching your new "novia" lying to you. I guarantee you she sees other guys whether they be gringos or ticos when you are not present. Don't K*D yourself buddy. It is irrelevant whether she is a working DR chica or not.

Dapanz, when are you planning to tie the knot?

Has this thread now become the Dapanz and chica thread? OK here's my two cents worth even though no one asked me. First to Dapanz. I know quite a few chicas here in CR who come here to work but NEVER work in their home country,The Dominican Republic because of the stigma attached if they are caught being a puta there. So your chica won't work there NOT because she loves you,but because that's what they do when they go home with the wheelbarell full of dollars. Next to Astro: Though I agree with almost everything you have been saying about this situation,I have to disagree with one point. My concern with Gringos falling for Chicas is not so much for the money spent on them ,but the emotional toll it takes when he finally realizes that the chica has been phucking with his head.

You are correct, that is the reason she does not work. That has been openly admitted. I'm sending her back to CR to be with all those that she loves. She can't wait to get back where she belongs.

dapanz1

_________________
Paradise= Sitting outside the Bodega in Panama City about 1 am. Drinking cool Balboas with cool friends and blazin' hot Colombianas. I want to be there..RIGHT NOW!

Personally, I think this thread has become quite interesting for 2 main reasons. First, as I had hoped, it expands on the results of Astro's original survey. But even more interesting to me is that so far the results have been far different than what I expected.

What does this mean to me? If one accepts Astro's new viewpoint, as I do that all, pros are also pros at lying and their side of the game is to use their skills to extract as much dinero as they can, that wouldn't really qualify as a novia using my definition. I see only two possible explanations. The first is that those responding that they've had successful novia relationships with DR pros are not using my definition of novia (How did you respond Astro?). The only other possibility that I see is that (if initial results are representative) there are far more guys on this board who are being fooled.

In my view, that by itself is not really such a bad thing. Perhaps they suspect or really know it in their hearts but do not care. That might be where Astro is at right now. And, as importantly, perhaps when the lies and demands for money reach the point where they can no longer be ignored or written off (and that time WILL come), these guys will be able to walk away to their next novia with a philosopical attitude and not much hurt. If they had a good ride and the price in money and emotional involvement was worth it to them for what they got out of it, I will be the last person to criticise them.

I'd also like to second some of the remarks stated above. My attitudes may seem cold to some, but like so many others, I don't fault these gals at all for what they do. The mainly come from backgrounds of abject poverty, often with abuse in their family history and they do what they can to try and create a better life. The path they have chosen is not an easy one emotionally. Many, if not most, guys simply use them for their sexual pleasure. Why shouldn't they try to use them back? And as to looking down at someone who takes money for sex with strangers, we PAY money for the same thing. If one must make a value judgement who does that really make worse?

I'd like to thank Dapanz for his openness in sharing his experience and the others for responding civilly and respectfully to his posts. But I'd like to encourage the others who responded that they've had a successful LTR with a DR pro-type to also share.

1) What I'd like to know is if any of them expected or believed their novia to stop her work?

2) Did they paid her any support to do stop working or paid for her to leave the country as Dapanz did?

3) If they knew her to be continuing what she did, how did they feel about that?

4) Did they regularly catch them in lies or at least suspect them of lying? And did they suspect she had another novio(s) who she was saying the same things to?

5) Was what made their relationship a LTR the fact that they were apart during much of that time? In other words how much of that 6+ months were actual together time in CR?

6) If they corresponded while apart, which I assume they did, how often did the subject of money come up in the calls and e-mails? At least once each time, occassionally, rarely? How soon did it start? Did it increase in frequency or amount over time.

7) If any other board members were witness to this relationship or knew the girls involved, what were their perspectives?

8 ) If the LTR is over how and why did it end? In other words, did you both depart as friends at least on speaking terms or did it really end badly?

9) If a member has selected option #3 and has had more than one CR novia, were all their novia relationships "successful" LTR's and if not what proportion were or not.

I'll probably have more questions but these will do for a start. As you can see I've got serious doubts about this whole thing. Somebody answer these questions and prove me wrong. As you can see there are others out there that still think this may be a good idea. They need a realistic picture of what they may be facing.


I just remembered that my original post that began this thread had loosened my more restrictive definition of novia to ignore whether there was primarily a monetary motivation, so I guess my main question would be how many of those who selected the 3rd answer wouldn't have if I hadn't removed that restriction.

Prolijo:

I have a number of examples I would like to share with the board.

1. First time monger wires money to keep chica out of DR. One time
he calls and hears a man's voice in the background. Stops sending
her money. Nothing gained

2. Chica e mails the same letter to every gringo she knows professing
her love and adoration and always asking for money along the way.

3. Recent friend of mine meets first time DR chica. A week later she
calls him professing her love and asking for money for diapers and
milk.

4. Personally I once received an e mail from a chica who was not
familiar with e mail. She had set up a list of gringos to receive the
letter. Fifteen names were broadcast with the exact same letter.

5. Chica quotes a price for a session and claims the price is per hour
if the session exceeds one hour.

The list goes on and on.

Does this mean it has ended? Badly?

_________________

Living well is the best revenge
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MwUtj_YnNoY

King says:

OOOH. That stings! No you misunderstood mi amigo. I caught her in a lie needing dinero....not about other dudes. I am assuming you are correct. I doubt if she is seeing other gringos, but other ticos...probably. The way this one loves sex, I doubt if she can last two months without it. God knows I can't.....so why should she? She lives in the barrio...where the ticos live right next to her. With her looks, personality, and love of sex, she may be the barrio pass around slut.

Do I have a problem with that? No, not really. Because I know that when I do finally get down there she will be ALL mine for the entire time I am there. Plus I am not kidding myself about this becoming a long term affair. I know it is short term. I plan to milk it for all it is worth which will probably be sex months or so. (opps....freudian slip. I meant SIX months)

I do really really like this one. She truly IS special to me. But I am not IN LOVE with her. I do love her, but mainly in a sexual way. I want the best for her, and hope that she will benefit from our relationship. I am helping her do some things to get out of the rut of horrible poverty that she is in. I hope that when this ends, she will be happy for having known me....and that I will have had numerous orgy's that I will always remember, when I tell my grand K*ds about it.....(just kidding).

Vegas Bob says:


I understand mi Amigo, and I think the same thing. However I do think if a guy has blown several thousand on his failed novia, he feels a lot worse than if he spent only a few hundred. It is one thing to have a broken heart, but then you add feelings of stupidity on top? That makes it worse. That is why I advise to NEVER pay them MORE than what you are getting back in return. As this thing moves along....if she is getting up on you....then you are getting upside down. That is when the hurt feelings begin. As long as you know...."at least I never paid more than what I got" you are OK. What you GET can be sex....or any number of other things that you wanted out of the deal.

But I agree with you VB, many of them DO Phuck with our heads. I don't think most of them see it that way. I don't think they realize that sometimes, we dumb gringos really DO fall for them. You should NEVER fully trust them. You should always assume they are lying. You should not expect you can get her to quit the Del Rey. You should always assume she is screwing somebody else. If you are OK with all that, then go ahead and forge a novia-like relationship. Just guard your heart. Love them, but never fall in love with them.

Prolijo....I selected option four, for what that is worth. But you have only had 12 votes, not exactly a scientific survey. Sorta like the exit polling that favored Kerry.

_________________
ASTROGLIDE

Why would someone want to have a "working girl" as a novia?
I tried to have a normal friendship with one of them and it didn't work out.
If you're interested in a novia, why don't you try your luck with the regular, non-working ones? It can be done and it's fun.

sorry double post

Valentino,
That is the million dollar question that this thread is really all about. You stated it a helluva lot more concisely than I (me?)

I'm guessing from your answer that you and Astro were the 2 so far that picked option#4.

King, we all already know where you stand on this. You can come up with all the third party anecdotal evidence you want. What I'm really interested in are first hand reports.

So far, there have been 5 guys, besides Dapanz, who have picked option#3. Those are the guys that I really want to hear from. Don't be shy. I only questioned Dapanz's answer because we had already seen reports back that suggested a different view, but by the terms I myself laid out he was technically correct in his selection. Anyhow, for the others who picked #3, I'm not out to tear you a new asshole. I'd really like to know about your experience. Were your answers dependent on my loosening the definition of novia or are successful LTR with "working girls" that are not money driven really possible?

Finally for those who have not yet experienced this but are thinking of giving it a try (option#5). Do you really think you will find true romance or is a "novia-like" experience as Astro described more of what you hope for?

Until I hear direct evidence to the contrary, I'll continue to believe any REAL novia experience with a DR puta is at BEST extremely unlikely. LTR's with non-gulch non-pros are a whole different story.Though STILL fraught with some difficult obstacles, THOSE are entirely possible.

And, while I never thought this day would come, I'm in complete agreement with Astro that "novia-like" or GFFE experiences of much more limited expectation, duration and scope can be a lot of fun IF one really keeps control that they are getting as much out of it as they are putting in, has no illusions of how it will probably end up and is emotionally prepared to deal with that day and move on.